An Analysis of 50% Curation Rewards in EIP and HF21 - All Delegators Should Read This

in #delegators5 years ago (edited)

I have read many people saying that they would like to see a numerical analysis of the forthcoming EIP. I have seen nothing but promises regarding the change from 25% to 50% curation rewards, so here is my mathematical analysis. If I've missed any similar posts, then please link to them in a comment; thanks.

What is Curation?

Before looking at the mathematics, I wish to spend a little time looking at some psychology. One thing that causes endless arguments is Steem's abuse of the word "curation". This Abuse of Language Syndrome has infected all discussion on this issue. The virus was first injected by Steem's original white paper, which claims that all upvotes are curation. Really!? Does anybody believe this? Most recently, steemitblog's own post states that, "Under these changes self-voting and bidbot usage will become less profitable than curating good content." Again, does anybody believe this?

So let's try and clean up the language first. Curation-reward-bots are not the same as human-quality-curators. Is that not obvious? Algorithmic-curation is very different to quality-curation and, by their very difference, bot-votes will always be more profitable than manual-votes.

Algorithmic-curation takes place largely within 15 minutes of posting - apart from those sniping upvote-buyers - and its only aim is to maximize curation rewards.

Quality-curation is done by humans and often many hours after the post was made. This in itself severely limits the curation rewards that such human-curators can earn just from their own upvote. Although curation groups do give their curators some incentives for their work, the issue here is that so-called curation-rewards form a very small part of the income of both the individual and the group because, again, their quality-votes take place long after the bot-votes.

One advice I often give to curators is to add their favourite authors to their own auto-voting-bot so that they too can earn longer term from algorithmic-curation.

So what words can we use so that people are not talking at cross-purposes about two very different modes of upvoting? I would suggest the simple human-curation and bot-curation. Pick your own favourite, but using "curation" when two people have different things in mind causes friction and is counter-productive.

With that out of the way, here's some mathematics.

The Upvote Trading Model at 25% Curation Rewards

I'm going to make some assumptions as we go along. Those assumptions are based on looking at the numbers on the blockchain for 2 years. Such assumptions are not universal but are very good estimates of the averages I've seen for various parameters and metrics. If you wish to quibble with some assumptions, then also supply your own calculations all the way through the process.

The Upvote Trading Model as currently exists on the Steem blockchain is a two-party exchange that in its essence works like this: User A sends a transfer to User B, then User B upvotes User A. That's it!

This is the source of so many profits and is also the reason why algorithmic earnings are taking over the blockchain. Before I move on, I must also stress that there are some posters who are well rewarded by the community and that such rewards are way beyond what they could earn algorithmically. There are also some whose posts are being rewarded for other work they may do behind the scenes as devs or mods etc. Thus, posting good content and being rewarded for it can work, but the problem is that posting crap, or even not posting at all, can also be highly rewarding.

OK, let's assume user A sends user B a transfer of 1 STEEM. I would also like to assume an ROI of 0% for A; that would mean an upvote from B of about 1.333 STEEM and makes the next numbers ugly to look at. Let's instead assume that A was lucky and gets a 5% ROI on the transfer. This results in an upvote from B worth 1.4 STEEM.

Now, 25% of that goes to curation, leaving A with rewards of 1.05 STEEM. Now, B already has 1 STEEM from A and will later also receive some "curation rewards"; these are likely to be far less than 25% and I shall estimate 15%; then 15% of the 1.4 STEEM upvote comes to about 0.2 STEEM. This gives B a total income of 1.2 STEEM.

So, let's firstly sum up what has just happened:
A has paid 1 STEEM for 1.05 STEEM worth of author rewards, plus let's not forget some curation rewards too, assuming A has strategically self-voted.
B has gained about 1.2 STEEM for a 1.4 STEEM upvote.

User A has a return of 105% and user B has a return of 86% based on the value of an upvote.

Why do people delegate to vote-selling services? Well, 86% is significantly higher than a self-vote that may only yield the 75% author-rewards.

Bidbots are just a particular kind of vote-seller and are able to increase that 86% return by allowing each round of bidding to end up with a negative ROI for the bidders.

Also note that as the Steem blockchain is currently yielding about 21% APR for an upvote, that vote-sellers can thus generate about 18% APR - even by being generous!

One last important thing to note is that the vote-sellers and their delegators are getting 11% more than the 75% expected as an author, and this comes to about a 15% increase above the author-reward rate. This figure will become important later.

The Upvote Trading Model at 50% Curation Rewards

Let's see what happens if we switch to 50% curation-rewards and 50% author-rewards.

We need to keep something constant, else the numbers become hard to compare, so I'm going to assume the generous vote-seller B gives the buyer A an effective reward of 1.05 STEEM on a 1 STEEM transfer.

At 50%, this means B must issue an upvote worth 2.1 STEEM so that half will go to A and the other 1.05 STEEM will go to curation-rewards.

Now, curation-rewards have doubled, but the curation algorithm is not being changed. That curation-rewards algorithm depends on the relative upvote size of each new upvote compared to the existing upvotes. It is thus not very clear whether my estimate of 15% curation to B will hold, or may even increase. The big assumption here is that although the rshares allocated to curation-rewards has doubled, this does not mean that all upvoters will change their own voting amounts. I've done some mathematical analysis of the formula and estimate that it is likely, because of the doubling of these bought upvotes, that they may make slightly more in curation; my best estimate is 20%. Let's look at both numbers to see how sensitive the calculations are.

With 15% curation reward income

Anyway, with 15% curation-rewards on a 2.1 STEEM upvote means about 0.32 STEEM will come back to B, giving the vote-seller a total income of 1.32 STEEM from a 2.1 STEEM upvote.

So, what has just happened?

User A is still getting 1.05 STEEM from a 1 STEEM transfer, whereas B now has 1.32 STEEM from a 2.1 STEEM upvote.

The return for A remains 105% whereas that for B has fallen to about 63%.

On the face of it, this is a large 23% drop from the 86% return with 25%-curation.

But remember that author-rewards have also now dropped to 50%, so that a 63% return is +13% on a self-vote; this means that the profit is 26% higher when compared to self-voted author-rewards.

This is a larger differential than now!

With 20% curation reward income

Replacing the 15% curation-rewards with 20% means that vote-seller B receives 0.42 STEEM in rewards plus the 1 STEEM transfer, giving a total of 1.42 STEEM from a 2.1 STEEM upvote.

This gives a return of 68% based on the upvote and +18% based on the 50% author-rewards, or 36% higher than self-voting!

What just happened?

The idea of a profit really depends on the basis for the calculation. For the vote-buyer this is obvious as they are sending a transfer of STEEM and wish to see that used profitably. For the vote-sellers, and their delegators, profit is relative to other forms of income on the blockchain and can either be measured based on a full upvote or on the author-rewards of a self-vote. Many delegators are just looking for a passive income without the complications of posting crap and upvoting it ten times a day - that isn't exactly passive. The leasing market tends to be priced just above the returns on author-rewards and below the APR of a full upvote, so these are valid calculations.

My calculations above have shown that income for the vote-sellers will drop significantly but that may not be so important for the delegators as their passive returns as a percentage of author-rewards will actually increase!

This means that vote-sellers such as bidbots may need to do little else but adjust their ROI and algo to mitigate some of their downturn in profits; other vote-sellers may need to adjust expectations.

One last thing to note is that vote-buyers are often in profit from other upvotes that are only there because they are chasing curation-rewards in the knowledge that a large upvote will later arrive. Such bidders do not require the bidbots themselves to have a positive ROI because of all the other votes they attract.

There are also vote-buyers who just do not have enough SP to even think about self-voting as an alternative. Again, any small profit comes largely from bidbot sniping algorithms, so they can tolerate a small negative ROI from their bids.

In Conclusion

We shall see how the whole ecosystem reacts to HF21 and then see how the macroeconomics of Steem reaches a new equilibrium. After HF19 there was a large drop in the reward pool that took a number of weeks to reach an equilibrium. In contrast, HF20 had no effect on the reward pool, save for the technical blip during the first week and that took a couple more weeks to resolve itself.

Let me return to the top: "Under these changes self-voting and bidbot usage will become less profitable than curating good content." They should have stopped at "... less profitable." As we have seen, self-voting will be less profitable as rewards drop from 75% of an upvote to 50%. Bidbots and other vote-selling services may only need to implement small tweaks. This is because the delegators to such services may well be earning more than before compared to the lower author-rewards. This is really the flaw in this whole system. Existing delegators will, indeed, experience some drop in the net earnings they have come to expect, but the increased premium above the lower author-rewards may well encourage new delegators to join.

The human curators will always be voting hours after a post is made and their upvote may well yield under 10% in curation-rewards - it will be double of what it was before, but just a larger pittance. This may, however, be good for those curation groups that deliver large votes; hopefully this will feed back to their hard-working individual curators. For genuine bloggers, there are a growing number of sites opening up such as PALnet. As they are all linked to the Steem blockchain, such authors may well be earning multiple tokens and coins from each post. This is going to be the way forward in the medium term.

If I may quote myself from an article posted some six months ago here: "The current set of encoded rules do not, and will not, by themselves, promote the kinds of social interactions people expect." HF21, or at least the EIP part of it, will be no exception. And also, from the same article: "It can be argued that Steem will be fine as a source of high interest profits for all the banker-members; that the social fabric can be built on top of this financial machine and that social-bankers can help fund this development."

In conclusion, let's sum up the headlines: the 50-50 split in author/curation rewards will see lower rewards for authors (obviously); lower net returns for vote-sellers and their delegators but higher percentage returns due to the lower benchmark of author-rewards (hence no disincentive to continue with just minor adjustments); vote-buying will remain potentially profitable due to curation-seeking upvotes sniping the vote-sellers; and higher curation-rewards to human-curator but only significantly so for large voting accounts. This in no way makes human-quality-curation more profitable than algorithmic-curation, as is the claim by EIP and HF21.

Is this what you were expecting?

So... where will all those extra curation-rewards go?

Algorithmic curation-reward mining.

Expect to see more tokens and projects "sharing rewards".

Be prepared.



As a coda, I believe there are possible solutions so that the economic code within the Steem blockchain can serve its original mission to be a social media blockchain and not just social media on a blockchain. The level 2 dapps such as PALnet, and others, have become a necessary development but they are also an opportunity that gives us the time to look back at the original economic code; keep the parts that work, such as the macroeconomics of STEEM and SBD but investigate those parts that seriously need an update, such as the microeconomics that everyone experiences.

I propose to submit a working group to SPS - anybody with the skills and interest may express their wish to join this project. Thanks for reading.



images: pixabay (edited)

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THis was interesting to read, thanks.
The question that is going to be very hard to address is, *what happens when downvotes are applied to content that may or may not have been boosted. If a voter comes along and decides to add a whatever value downvote, author runs the risk of making a loss and curators have the gap closed further to the 50/50 of curation, right? If ost of the purchasers are coming from larger buyers, if they are forced to stop buying because the community decides to downvote it, more buyers are needed to reach the max ROI, which could prove difficult. This is not able to be calculated until we can see if the community will downvote - but it does add a layer of complexity and risk that wasn't present earlier (at least not with zero cost like HF21)

I don't disagree with the downvote pool. If for nothing else it will help those who do use downvotes for the good of the platform and are now giving up potential upvote returns to do so.

I also don't think we'll see any more people doing downvotes. The culture of people reacting badly to them is well established and unlikely to change any time soon. So, it will only be larger accounts downvoting smaller accounts and more wars starting if there is an increase.

Pessimistic? Maybe. Or maybe I've just seen enough of this over the last 3 years to realize that while downvotes are supposed to be a healthy part of the ecosystem, they are anything but.

The culture of people reacting badly to them is well established and unlikely to change any time soon.

I agree but, it can change at some point slowly.

Pessimistic? Maybe. Or maybe I've just seen enough of this over the last 3 years to realize that while downvotes are supposed to be a healthy part of the ecosystem, they are anything but.

The difference is this time there is incentive for everyone, including authors to take an active role. Whether they do is up to them.

As an author I don't see any incentive for me to downvote and invite a flagwar. I have rarely used downvotes during my time here. They usually have always been responding to someone being bullied or plagiarism. Although I eventually realized when it came to plagiarism I was better off to report the person to Steemcleaners and let them deal with it.

So, maybe you can explain how there is an incentive?

They usually have always been responding to someone being bullied or plagiarism.

Just continue doing this to return it to the pool and you will still have 10 full votes to reward the content you do enjoy. Slowly it will reduce the plagiarism and the like. If everyone does it, the place looks better without it costing them. curate positively and negatively the areas you care about.

When it comes to the big voters, they should be stepping up to take care of the big abusers an as independents, they can moderate the places they care about too. Steemcleaners is limited to a framework of abuse only, individuals are free to choose.

I guess that is where I see the problems largely are @tarazkp ... I have watched over the last three years and some (very few) of the larger voters have tried to stem abuse and virtually no support from their peers. I don't really see that ending and them finally realizing they have a role to play that is not all about their own profits.

That is one of the reasons I've had respect for bernie ... as off the wall as he can be, at the root of it has always been trying to clean up bad actors.

If I'm wrong and some of them do take their heads out of the windowless place they are and start stepping up. Some of the middle level voters may follow suit. Until it starts at the big guys... I rather expect the rest will carry on as is and and other than some new flag wars, the crud will continue.

... I have watched over the last three years and some (very few) of the larger voters have tried to stem abuse and virtually no support from their peers. I don't really see that ending and them finally realizing they have a role to play that is not all about their own profits.

The difference is this time that there is no cost for 2.5x for that downvote, up until now there always has been.

Until it starts at the big guys...

maybe it will, maybe it will be the most of the active voting stake on the platform of orcas and dolphins that do it. 1800 odd active dolphin or orcas and 6000 active minnows might make a difference, if they choose to.

I can't fault your optimism @tarazkp ..I hope I'm wrong and it's well placed. Time will tell.

Agreed. I've probably used the chain in a similar way to you - any genuine abuse can always be reported; I don't need to enter a flag tit-for-tat. And if I was to downvote everything I disagreed with, I'd soon end up without any VP or RC left ;-)

Yeah I stay right away from the 'this post is overvalued' concept. Value of posts is subjective at best. I've seen some really lousy writing get great upvotes cause at least some of the readers don't care how painful it is to read.

haha... that's funny... One thing I did mention is that some people are not actually being upvoted for the quality of their articles but rather for other work they may be doing within chatrooms etc. Not everyone, but some.

this is true. There some folks doing some good work and people want to support them. I do hope that when folks upvote my work it is more about the work than anything else I'm doing. Improving as a writer is important to me.

I really wanted to focus on the curation issue as I was seeing a lot of confused comments and a lot of wishful thinking, and it is more amenable to mathematical analysis. I avoided the downvotes as it seems like more of a social issue and therefore calculations will be more meaningful once we see how people (and their bots) react.

I avoided the downvotes as it seems like more of a social issue and therefore calculations will be more meaningful once we see how people (and their bots) react.

Yep, I completely understand. It is going to be an interesting HF at least because it brings in the chance for more social performance factors that can't be calculated at this point.

agreed, the downvotes will largely depend on behaviour but the votes are math. The impact of the bot voting is important to have a clear view of. You attending @aggroed's witness forum today? It's on at 1pm EDT in the PAL discord.

Wasn't planning to - it's midnight here!! But as I'm awake I'll see what 1 pm EDT means for me... might be 2 AM... I'll check.

Oh ok, it's like... almost now! sure, why not. thanks for the heads up.

To listen to the audio version of this article click on the play image.

Brought to you by @tts. If you find it useful please consider upvoting this reply.

The bid bots will have to stake multiple tokens for a vote buyer to get any ROI, 1 vote will give you multiple tokens like pal, sportstalk, spt and others, right?

so for clarity sake @rycharde based on the calculations and scenarios you've looked at .... for or against EIP at this time?

Given that the EIP does not actually deliver what it claims to, and furthermore has not been presented with anything approaching the analysis I have done, I am against it.

It is just tinkering with the same old parameters. When will the devs learn that this isn't working? Every top blockchain is working towards improving their chain, be it technically or economically. It is time to at least take a serious look at a Steem V2!!

This will drive Steem further towards what it is already becoming, and I described in my previous article as blockchain-banking. If everybody thinks this is a great idea, fine, but there is nothing social about it - that will happen on new platforms such as palnet and others.

When it actually gets implemented, I shall be neutral and do what I have to do to make the most of it.

(Pessimistic? Possibly more than you, or evens, lol)

i really do think it is wishful thinking that the behaviour will change enough to get the results even heading in the direction they are projecting.

I'm thinking at this point that if it gets implemented as is, I will likely shoot for continuing to post but likely shorter and maybe more frequently until I see exactly how things are going to shake out. Sadly some of those I care about on this platform are either leaving or thinking about it.

the analysis is something that hasn't been tried from what I could see other than @dreemsteem's where she compared incomes for various levels of members before and after.

You've focused on the vote buying which is very important as well.

@timcliff I think this is relevant to our conversation. Have the witnesses even looked at these numbers or just tried to project what behaviour is going to be?

Thanks, hadn't seen her articles; let me link her in:
https://steemit.com/hardfork/@dreemsteem/now-you-can-see-the-numbers
That is interesting in that my analysis that large curation accounts will do well is bourne out - smaller individuals, I'm less sure about and hopefully they will earn some more from working within those groups such as Curie.

Lemme read her other post...

It was important to focus on vote trading as it was one of EIP's main claims: that human-curation would become more profitable than vote-trading. I've shown that's not true. I didn't even go into algorithmic-curation-mining ;-)

might be worth bringing your results to the attention of the witnesses especially the top 20. There hasn't been any indication they have actually looked at the mathematical outcomes.

Agreed, you possibly know more of them than I do. I dislike tagging but with so many other things going on might be worth doing. What do you think?
Just having a look to see who I've had contact with....

give it a go... the worst they will do is ignore the tag.

Would be good to get the opinions of some that will be directly affected, such a @therealwolf and @yabapmatt.
@ocd-witness and @curie should both be happy with these changes in curation rewards but not sure about their views on the whole package.

There were only 2 top witnesses who are against EIP - can't recall the 2nd person; will need to look it up.

@drakos was the second one .. he's #21 though

It was important to focus on vote trading as it was one of EIP's main claims: that human-curation would become more profitable than vote-trading. I've shown that's not true. I didn't even go into algorithmic-curation-mining ;-)

Well @rycharde. You should!! You actually should go balls-deep into the 'algorithmic-curation-mining' dark abyss to know better the kind of specimens living in the abyssal fauna throughout this ocean. There are some that even have their own light you know? And most of them are convinced that we must also follow blindly the 'light' they emanate.

However, I still have a small flashlight handy to light my way thru in my very own cranky style. };)

Cheers!!

Thanks, but it isn't even in the dark; 50% curation plus the crushing of small votes plus the new 1 minute reverse auction - all shine a bright light on what is going to happen.

Even when people watch the corporate news, they still don't understand what they are really being told.

Your calculations confirm my reasoning on what will happen if the new hard fork goes through. It will make it harder for minnows and redfish and not easier. It will limit flow and not increase it. Now, they can't even get profit out of bid-bot. (Not a fan of bit bots but I have seen them work for some redfish)

If we want to increase engagement, rewards must be linked to engagement. An engagement score applied to payout would work wonderfully or even just an engagement score replacing rep scores. So someone new to the platform knows whether or not their #humansteem will be reciprocated​.

To my mind the EIP portion of the proposed HF is ill-conceived and we would be better keeping what we have now and instead enlisting a marketing firm.

I promised I would read it - and though it is about to be 1 am... i still consider it "today" and not "tomorrow" because going to sleep indicates tomorrow. hahahahahaha

your brain is quite the machine... I MOSTLY followed it. but the only thing I need you to do is say

cheerleaders are right, @ats-david.

hehehe he would read this but i've sent him to bed because he is too busy chasing cheerleaders and trying to convince them to stay on the blockchain cuz he is enamored with them OBVIOUSLY. 😜

(this is what happens when you read way too many posts and become punch drunk when you should be sleeping)

I'm about to go to sleep - but before you did all this amazing mathematics... I knew that it would come out to point to exactly what I said

you cannot change the system, expecting that people will do the right thing. Bad guys will always find a way to ruin the old system, the new system and the future system. This proposal not only allows the bad guys to keep doing what they're doing - but it hurts the little guys too.

The human curators will always be voting hours after a post is made and their upvote may well yield under 10% in curation-rewards - it will be double of what it was before, but just a larger pittance. This may, however, be good for those curation groups that deliver large votes

mm hmm.

oh well. my bed calls me to sleep... no one is listening to us...life goes on.

:)

I sent you a quick msg on Discord - I suspect we are in very different timezones! Never mind, that's what the internet is for.

I've written on this before, many months ago, and still think that many users have a deep psychological problem with making the most of what Steem is rather than what it pretends to be.

Nothing stops the smaller user using earning techniques that will increase their percentage incomes - the problem here is that a high percentage of very little is even less, but it validates the point that staking steem compounds income.

Anyway, nearly everyone was sold on the mantra that Steem is a "social media blockchain" only to discover fairly quickly that it isn't - not in the way advertised.

The only things we can do are those actions that have been encoded on the blockchain. The totality and interactions of those actions constitute the economy of Steem. Those actions are fundamentally financial so that it is possible to make money without any human interaction.

That's OK; that's a financial blockchain, but it isn't a social media blockchain. Hence we are seeing the social side being developed in level dapps such as PALnet and others.

The basic fundamental flaw in the design is that Steemit took a social media model (such as FB) and added financial incentives without creating a deeper, more flexible, economy that also took into account all the flaws in the existing social media networks.

They took a social media protocol and added economics to it.

It should have been the other way round.

Create an economic system and then build social media on top of that.

getting long...

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Well as a mathematician this is right up your alley!

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