Steemit Passive Accounts and Generating a Return on Investment
During the ‘Closing Dinner’ at SF3 I had a long conversation with @shanibeer about investing in the STEEM blockchain for passive income. I have mixed feelings about this term when it comes to something I care about.
While I am all for new money coming into the eco-system, the thought of using Steemit as a ‘milking-machine’ doesn’t really go down very well with me.
This is a blogging platform meant for active people promoting their content, but then I don’t complain when passive Orca’s vote up my content. No, that gives me an incentive to continue and write more if anything.
During this conversation I mentioned that my passive voting account, @chops.support is just this, something that generates a ROI that could exceed the stock market and certainly the dreadful interest rates that the high street banks offer us.
This account does power up 100% of its returns however to help other’s that I feel are doing good things in terms of content output. Nothing has been taken out and nothing will be for a very long time.
I think powering up a new passive Orca or Dolphin account could work well for the long-term investor and would certainly be appreciated by me and others in terms of the votes it could hand out, but if it just pulls the profits out by powering down every month and not growing, then it is not helping the platform whatsoever.
To get back to @shanibeer’s original request, I have checked the last 30 days of the @chops.support account in terms of curation rewards only.
15.93SP has been generated in the last 30 days with an investment of 1727SP.
Some of this is delegated and it has received more delegation recently of 300SP by me and 100SP by @shanibeer (thank you!), so it isn’t really an ideal time to try and show the true ROI of a static investment.
If 1 month generates 15SP, then 12 months will generate 15 x 12 = 180SP. This represents an ROI of 10.4% annually based off the SP invested.
Bear in mind that this is the last 30 days only, and with the increased delegation comes increased voting weight and more SP earned. It’s likely a greater figure now.
The @chops.support account currently votes up 54 accounts, most at a 50% vote weight but a few at 100% once a day. I try to keep the VP at between 80-90%, currently it’s 84%.
To gain a wider perspective on passive voting accounts, let us look at some of the passive Orca’s that are on Steemit. This will give a more true representation of ROI over time.
@redes (25), no comments, no posts, 134,345 SP.
SP earned in the last 30 days = 719 SP.
Potential SP to be earned per annum = 8628 SP.
ROI per year = 6.4%
@alexis555 (25), no comments, no posts, 186,988 SP.
SP earned in the last 30 days = 928 SP.
Potential SP to be earned per annum = 11136 SP.
ROI per year = 5.9%
@ripperone (25), no comments, no posts, 129,917 SP.
SP earned in the last 30 days = 707 SP.
Potential SP to be earned per annum = 8484 SP.
ROI per year = 6.5%
@newhope (25), no comments, no posts, 214,988 SP.
SP earned in the last 30 days = 1065 SP.
Potential SP to be earned per annum = 12780 SP.
ROI per year = 5.9%
@mangos (25), no comments, no posts, 92,575 SP.
SP earned in the last 30 days = 511 SP.
Potential SP to be earned per annum = 6132 SP.
ROI per year = 6.6%
It seems @chops.support is doing better than all these big guys in terms of curation! Take the information and have a look yourself. Everything is there for anyone to see.
I get votes from these big guys sometimes and am very grateful for them all.
Passive accounts are great for active content creators as recipient of their votes but places responsibility on the controlling owners on where the auto-votes are placed.
Given the massive volatility of STEEM and all crypto-currencies it’s a huge risk to invest in it, so only use money you can afford to lose, and I mean all of it.
Don’t take my word for it that you are going to gain by creating a passive Minnow, Dolphin or even an Orca account.
5-6% ROI seems good, but I’m in no position to give out financial advice so do your own detective work before trying this.
If you found this article so invigorating that you are now a positively googly-eyed, drooling lunatic with dripping saliva or even if you liked it just a bit, then please upvote, comment, resteem, engage me or all of these things.
Bang on with the 5 passive Orca curation accounts. These have been around for a long time. I suspect Steemit are linked in some way, but don't hold me to that as I'm only guessing.
These accounts vote too big for 10% yearly ROI and should probably halve the vote weight and double the content reached.
I run a curation account too (trailing another), it doesn't front run bots, or vote for me, but does do reasonably well in finding decent content and earnings.
I say go for it with a % of your SP, and then support the people and content you enjoy and don't worry about returns.
Cheers!
EDIT: This post just released showing the power of passive voting
https://steemit.com/steemit/@jacksartori/what-is-steemauto-and-why-you-should-support-it
There may be more than 5, interesting hypothesis you have on who controls them. They are hardly going to pipe up and break the silence though!
I got a vote from @redes, that was appreciated. I notice @chops.support wasn't even on the last curation chart after doing well in the first one. I may have to tweak the timing a little.
I would have given the other post a vote, except... well you can probably guess why I haven't. Everyone makes their choices.
It could be your timing, but more likely what @shanibeer says below. Check out @holger80, he's got a far more technical approach which will give you more details on best vote, etc.
I waited to vote on that post at 10 mins, didn't refresh the page, and when i voted it update with... yeah. :/
Is this the post you're referring to @abh12345 ?https://steemit.com/steemdev/@holger80/rewarding-paid-out-posts-without-using-python
https://steemit.com/curation/@holger80/holger80-s-curation-league-week-14-steem-prizes-available
Seems he's not done a post recently :(
Thanks @abh12345. Will take a look at that in the morning. Zzzzzzz.
@chops.support won't show in the curation leagues when there are changes in delegations; I'm always messing about with delegations so I don't appear in it very much either these days. But the formula is quite simple and you can get an idea how @chops.support is doing against the listed accounts.
Correct :)
Need to sit tight for 2 weeks with delegations to have a chance of appearing. Or you can head to @holger80's curation post that he puts out each week.
This is exactly why I have long-term faith in Steemit. It was set up to allow all this to be possible. I think it's genius.
I'm glad to hear it, keep the faith :D
I think the conversation we were having (although it was after two cherry vodkas and some sleeps ago now) was about thinkIng about accounts as growing investments, rather than (immediate) income producers. Even when the price is low, or even regardless of price, the proportion of steem earned (through curation, posting, delegating, selling) against the proportion of steem held far outran return on investment in other options (various accounts, ISAS etc). I was always interested in @slobberchops comments about ROI on, for example, a @treeplanter vote, rather than the actual amount of the vote. My pension plan is dropping in value at the moment, about 8% so far (and it will go up again ... eventually. It's just a problem if you need the money now) but there's no option to increase the number of units I hold, except by putting more money in. With steem, you perpetually have the opportunity to earn, one way or another, more units or tokens.
This is exactly what I've been saying, actually in several comments (including the one I just posted). It's sad to see so many people tearing their hair out when the Steem price drops - yes, it can be a bit worrying, as Steemit is such a new platform - but few people have the long-term investment vision, it seems. I think we need to have more faith in Steemit being here for the long term.
Very interesting. I had always hoped to one day get my account to the level that I can actually see some form of returns. Of course, I am always rolling any SBD or Steem I make into SP, so it isn't like I am gaining anything from this anyway. I guess it is good that I have a full time job to pay the bills! I like being able to throw some bigger votes around here and there and the idea of having everything automated would probably get boring for me anyway.
It's quite interesting to have a passive account @bozz. I have to maintain this other besides my main one, and unexpected things happen sometimes... like a delegation comes from nowhere!
I'm looking for a few new people to add to it for a few weeks, finding quality new ones is hard though.
This is so true - thanks for doing that research, which is fascinating. I've noticed this myself with one or two other accounts on Steemit.
I have a small amount of money invested in SP, and I have a much larger amount invested in a self-invested pension plan. A few years ago, I bought a retail property with half of that private pension, and as it's a stakeholder pension, I had to get a financial advisor. He charges about £2k a year, but he's added a lot more than that to my pension fund, by re-investing it in funds using his expert knowledge of these things. In fact, my pension pot is now worth as much as it was before I bought the shop.
But when I express joy at this growth, my financial advisor actually gets a bit annoyed, and says, "This is just due to the stock market. At some point it will go down! This investment is for the long term, and in the long term you should expect about 5.5% growth."
Investments are not about speculation, they're about passive income, and explosive growth is just a bonus. If more people understood that, more people would invest in SP for the long term instead of panicking and powering down during bear markets, and then Steemit's value would be much higher than it is!
We will see what happens, its hovering around 40c, any my finger is hovering around the buy button too. Choices...
Go on, buy! I would – if I had any money left!
This is a great post @slobberchops . I do think that to help the impoverished help themselves, that studies and research like this are really important. This is a genuinely great and interesting read.
My views on auto curation are well known but perhaps softening as I have decided my primary 'want' from Steemit is to help people to better their own lives, especially of course, those that really need a helping hand and as such, auto curation can help.
I also of course, know your views on bidbots, but they take on a role you don't seem to have noticed in your analysis of your curstion trail. (thank you by the, appreciated).
I sometimes use bid bots but I NEVER use them quickly, I wait first for my few autovotes to come in, and then sometime for any organic votes and comments. This way, the curation rewards for the organic voters are increased exponentially by me using the bidbot, everyone benefits.
The more people on your curation trail using bidbots, the bigger your ROI. Thats about all I can add to this super thread.
Give me a week to get a delegation back and I will also bung your chops account 100SP.
Take care mate and Kumusta po kayo to the Missus :-)
Thanks Nathen, I am trying to give support to a) people who didnt ignore me when I was a 15SP fish, b) people who give a shit and c) new people who need a helping hand by way of the @chops account.
You really dont need to delegate to it, you dont have that much SP. Keep it for yourself to help who you think needs it most, but thanks for the offer, thats generous of you.
Yes BidBots can give the voters before big curation rewards, and my stance one them is I will never use them, but Im not bigoted enough to respect the opinions of others.
Ill be doing an abuse post on bidbots in the future and my opinions of them (though you already know this!).
Will say hello the @bingbabe, she knows about you :)
The thing is unless you're earning more than Steem inflation (currently 9.5%? or so and decreasing as time goes on) then your share is being diluted. So whatever you are earning from posting, curating and holding sp has to be more than this amount really. This is assuming the market cap stayed the same.
This does need to be taken into consideration and I can only present the facts as I see them.
The @chops.support account hasnt really been created to generate ROI (though it does), but to help people along a little.
If one was to create an account simply for ROI, then well.. I'm glad you pointed this out.
Well who knows, Steem might one day reach $100 and it will be better to accumulate 5% than doing nothing with your stake, but with both options it would be f-ing great outcome. 😁
But isn't your account constantly having steem added to it to counteract inflation? This is why delegations grow from the original nice round figure to a larger amount with decimal numbers. I love watching this little tool.
.
Yes 15% of the reward pool is given to SP holders, so those that have powered up.
The reward pool is the inflation.
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Thanks for writing this, you set out these ideas so well. It's a really useful (and heartening) way of thinking about things. I've just done a little report on growth in the needleworkmonday community and, although, it's quite small numbers, the rate of growth (or return) is very good. The smallest accounts increased by 60% overall, thanks to a small amount of delegation to each of them, and the corresponding growth on the delegation was about 23%. Not that that benefitted the delegator, but it was interesting to illustrate the value of sharing around some SP. I think there are some other similar models.
Yes, despite smaller number the ROI is always similar. I did a check on the @chops.account months before and it was around 6%. The current inflated figure must be due to some other factors.
Given the SP rewards just for being powered up and the 6% I still think it's a decent investment despite what @pjau mentions quite rightly about the inflation rate.
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It's a bit late for me to take this in right now @slobberchops but it's exactly what I need t think about.
I'll take a closer look tomorrow and also at the link @abh12345 posted.
I tell you I certainly appreciate your support and that of your pesky eye with the split personality.
That passive income is being calculated in an extreme depression when upvotes are almost worthless. It would definitely be close to time to make those orca accounts using FIAT to help the active steemians while this stuff gets back up to $3.50.
Think of making 10x by investing when STEEM was 1$. $10 STEEM? Not a sure bet. 10X $0.461280 USD is $4.60. THAT I can imagine. ALL ABOARD!
I'm biding my time for a buy. It's all crashing right now and perfect for buying,, but where is the bottom. Orca status is still out of my league just yet but I'm working on it.