HF20 Update: Hardfork Complete

in steem •  10 months ago  (edited)

HF20 RC Patch.jpg

Congratulations Steemians, today we made history by completing Steem’s 20th hardfork, codenamed “Velocity.” The Steem ecosystem is now being governed by the distribution of Resource Credits which will ensure a more sustainable and scalable future for Steem.

Equilibration in Progress

We are aware that users are experiencing issues posting to Steem and are monitoring the situation, but as of now the equilibration process is going largely as expected. And yes, equilibration is a word :). RCs are regenerating so if you cannot post now, you will be able to post once your RCs regenerate.

Patch for Negative RCs

One issue that has arisen is that users who were highly active before the hardfork are presenting negative Resource Credit balances. This is effectively RC “debt” that they accumulated prior to the hardfork. While the RC system is functioning properly in this context, it is causing a negative user experience especially for small SP holders which we are remedying with a patch that should go live within 12 hours.

This patch is effectively a RC “debt forgiveness” program that will set all negative RC balances to zero as of the time of the hardfork. This will dramatically improve the user experience for small SP holders by enabling their RCs to regenerate to a level that enables them to transact much sooner. Due to the nature of the change we expect it to go into effect within 12 hours. We understand that people are eager to resume using their favorite Steem DApps, and we are doing everything we can to get this patch merged as soon as possible.

Account Creations and State Bytes

We are already gaining valuable information about what operations consume a disproportionate amount of network resources. Account creations, for example, are extremely expensive in terms of state bytes, which means that creating accounts will deplete RCs rapidly. The RC system uses three measurements to determine how much an operation should cost in terms of RCs: blockchain size, compute time, and state size. These three measurements were chosen because they can be computed at low cost to the blockchain and they are tightly correlated with real resource consumption. If an operation is especially expensive in any one of these measurements, then performing that operation will be costly in terms of RCs.

It is important to bear in mind that these are objective measurements of resource consumption at the blockchain level, so when something is expensive in RCs, all that means is that performing the action places a high burden on the network relative to other operations. In other words, this is important information that we want to have as it helps us gain a deeper understanding of how resources are consumed by the blockchain. If you would like to learn more about how the system works, check out our previous post on Resource Credits.

As we stated in yesterday’s post, due to the fact that the RC system is a dramatic change relative to the old and inaccurate bandwidth system, there would be certain unforeseeable consequences including potentially negative user experiences while the system reaches equilibrium. We appreciate your patience as the system continues to adapt and as the patch goes into effect that is designed to improve the user experience of small SP holders.

Steemit Team

Update

An unrelated issue with voting power was uncovered that resulted in many accounts having lower voting power than expected. This issue affects everyone who has posted in the last 5 days equally. Most accounts that have been active will return to their expected voting power equilibrium within one day, while the remainder will take no longer than 5 days. To learn more, read this update.

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Sorry guys, this HF was no success, this is a desaster.

Nearly everybody below ORCA-Level is not able to do anything.

I voted twice after the HF20 and my voting power dropped from around 50% to 1.5%. Please check if there is not another bug in the current software version.

Du bekommst meinen ersten Vote, seit ich auf 100% Voting Mana aufgeladen habe. Ehre, wem Ehre gebührt :-)
Ich hoffe, dass das System sich nun wieder gutmütig verhält.
Bei den nächsten Votes werde ich es sehen.
Let's make Steemit great again!

Danke Dir!

Given the size of the upgrade I'd say it was a relative success.

We are only having a hard time doing actions using the public facing websites like steemit. The network is working fine in the back. Full functionality should come back to Steemit.com after the replay process of their RPC nodes which should complete in a few more hours.

"We are only having a hard time doing actions using the public facing websites like steemit."

So it's been working fine except for the parts the vast majority of people see and use.

I hope that in future steemit.inc is focused on "Custeemer first"

#custeemerfirst
#customerfirst

P.S.: I will vote your comment on Sunday too, does not make sense to vote atm

I am not going to bother with trying to game the system. I intend to just maintain normal activity levels despite the upheaval.

We are only having a hard time doing actions using the public facing websites like steemit.

This is not at all true. It was not an interface issue.

This is either abject ignorance or very poor spin.

The main problem was negative mana which had been solved on all but RPC nodes. I wasn't able to post this when steemit was on 0.20.2 now I can.

I agree that claiming success was wrong and premature.

Of course the chain is running fine, but we had a Service Outage for 99,9% of the STEEM users for 24 Hours and I assume that a lot of curators will vote no posts within the next 3-4 days until they reach their usually Votingpower.

At the current state of the STEEM ecosystem such a downtime is annoying, but if we look a few years ahead, and then run more and larger applications on the chain, that's just not allowed to happen.

So this basically means to me that posting material right now is practically useless (if one can post at all) because people won't be voting?

I can only speak for myself here, but I will not vote before sunday, and I will not scroll down my feed and discord bots for older posts. And I assume that a lot of curators will do the same.

I plan to keep on posting regardless of the chaos.

For the most part, you're right, but there will be a few votes. People will be acting VERY conservatively with their votes right now.

Well, your post was 14 hours ago, so I have to ask "how long is 'a few hours' for you?"
Hardfuck 20 took place on 25 September.
Your alert says users may experience problems "for 24 hours."
Today is 27 September.
I have not posted in 12 days, but your system says I have "run out of resource credits" and cannot post my latest writing.
How is this "working fine?"

Read the article above about waiting 24 hours? Hope in a couple hours things are worked out, I am able to do more and see improvements

Before HF20 I didn't read anywhere that my voting power is set to zero. It is incomprehensible to me that this basic usecase was not properly tested.

How could they test without implementing?

We have to pass the bill to see what's in it, eh? This is the kind of problem that should have been caught in some kind of sandbox fork test.

100% agreement.
It would have been so much easier if they would have properly tested it in previous. These are bugs which must have been noticed then.

Or they just do not everything in one time and split the whole hardfork to correct bugs before they are relevant. This could have been done by introducing the protocolls of resource credits and voting mana first and letting them equilibrate for a week fixing all bugs found. After that they could have made the "real" hardfork by giving these protocols their function. So before they were just existing and after the second change they were the variables which matter for actions on the blockchain.

Although my VP is nearly vanishing, I gave you my 100%.
Now I am at 22%. But you deserve it.
From now I will stop voting for 5 days. I read this is the time period needed for avoiding further trouble with the VP, right?

Thank you very much @diana.feuerberg. I will also continue voting (also your comment) on Sunday, when my VP is back at 80-100%.

No... relax and resume normal operations soon we will all learn more

Yeah bro I Can't even post anything.

how long would it take before we can Access our Steem Account in term of Posting

yikes luckily posting worked for me but we need to keep eyes open for possible bugs

Does "successful" include being able to post/comment/vote? Asking for a friend

Read the post about waiting 24 hours? Asking for sanities sake?

I'll have to tell my friend since I was asking for him

Gotta wait 5 more days now :O

Don't worry, everything is in control.

They'll just create a "PostToken" to further complicate and screw the blockchain into the ground. Oh and maybe a "OopsieToken" to monetize the next series of PoS blunders.

Who am I kidding, the Steemit faithful will continue to support this farce right up to the last shuddering block.

So am i not the only one who cant upload video right now? lol I am just learning about this.

Nah man you were definitely not alone. The majority of users couldn't do anything

You are not alone

lol nice one

Oh god - is this what we have to do now on Steem?

Yes, yes it is.

LOL

why so bored?

i've upvote some post just 2 times... my steem power from 100% down into 36% somehow after this hardfork or something this regular joe missing???

Be patient, read the message about waiting 24 hours yet? Been 22

ah... just login and never know there's hardfork on date, just regular joe here.... thank you for the info sir/madam

Lets hope for a quick recovery!

Just being honest, it seems to ber a mess, I ´m unable to do anything here, I do not get what mana or whatever is, I´m not feelin good with it. All my hope was put on steemit as an alternative to make good money on Internet, now it is smooth, I want to believe you guys will fix this. As the majority of the community here, cannot do anything.

Can this also be the reason why it was impossible to upload to DTube for the past 2 days? I kept getting an "unknown error" message after teh video had finished uploading and conversion...

What the heck steemit inc.??
The network is basically dead, only empty blocks for like 17 hours now:


And you re like "great success" ???

1 mln SP is not enough to make any transaction. Why are you keep saying "small SP holders" when the problem is clearly not related to the amount of SP? 99.99% of users cant use the network now, no mater how much SP they have.

And then the voting power bug. Lots of dapps and investors will lose money and you re like "well, yeah, wait 5 days - fixed, lol"

I can understand a fuck up but calling it a success? You should clreatly state that the bug with negative RC affects basically every user and is not related to any "equilibration" but a fucked up code.

I could not agree more. I upvoted onece in 3 days because I was out of town. I come back to no power to do anything. I am now waiting for my SP to disapear as well. Looks like these clowns did not do much testing before they went live. I cannot upvote your comment because they took away all my voting power. Normall I never let it get below 80% . Now I am in the 20%.

I agree. This wasn't a little error, this was an order of magnitude error.

As an example, yesterday i was at NEGATVE 16 quadrillion
today i am at postive 400 billion.

And, although i have 1.5 MVests (not big / not small) i am draining my mana too fast from my replies.
I manually vote, and manually reply after reading the post. I should have no problem.
I should be above 90% mana at all times.
But, my mana is only going down. It should be replenishing faster than i use it.

(and then the voting disaster... i don't know what to do there. Not vote for 4 days?)

At least your RC max_mana is “correctly” (as apparently designed) a million times your Vests. Some accounts being lower (than designed?) such as for example only1 13347 times Vests thus making the site entirely unusable. I do not think the devs[tinker-tots] are aware of this bug.

1 I.e. million ÷ 13347 = 75 times less RC than potentially designed!


EDIT: see the reply from @smooth. WTF?! Yeah I figured that might be the case (the pattern is obvious across numerous accounts). Yet I was hoping they’re not that conniving, i.e. that it would be a bug. Alas they’ve decided to enslave pending power down STEEM POWER (SP) in 13 weeks (6.5 weighted average) of inactive purgatory w.r.t resource credits (RC) before it’s actually powered down![note second clarifying reply from @smooth]

Tinker-tots are more incompetent than Murdoch and Marissa Mayer combined (shudder).

FYI only one week of power down (1/13) is inactive. The reason for this is to preserve consistency of RC mana status between SP and STEEM. Liquid STEEM is considered fully-charged so that when you power up you get RC mana credit immediately. SP by contrast is in a variable state of charge depending on recent usage. In order to ensure that liquid STEEM is fully charged when it powers down (and avoid double spend exploits), it has to remain inactive for a period of time prior to power down. Fixing this period at 7 days is an implementation convenience.

Can hardly post....

  ·  10 months ago (edited)

You have to subtract the pending vesting withdraw installment before calculating RCs, which takes the account down to almost nothing, so the very low max RC is correct.

Vesting withdraw rate 1,785,191.628750 VESTS
Next vesting withdrawal "in 6 days"

Considering the size and scope of the upgrade it was a relative success. (post updated to remove "success")

We are only having troubles doing actions using the public facing websites like Steemit.com. The decentralized part of the network is working fine in the back.

Working good for me

Right, after 24 hours not being able to do anything you are now here with 30% Voting Power. Great that you like how it went.

Not perfect yet I will stay positive and hope for quick solutions.

Crazy, why would they think to start RC and voting power at 0?? Why not start it at the previous value (convert to percent).

Please Note: The Steem blockchain was upgraded earlier today. You may experience trouble posting and transacting while the new bandwidth system stabilizes over the next 24 hours. It may be best to wait until this process completes before buying more Steem Power.
@steemitblog

Read the post? Give it 24 hours yet?
Be patient, STEEM to the moon!

Hire a new PR person, because this post and the HF are a fucking travesty. That was a total and utter shitshow. And your public facing reaction of everything being just fine and we all just have to wait makes me lose all fucking confidence in Steem.

This reaction to a HUGE fucking problem makes me think you guys should be replaced as soon as possible.

You better fucking hope that no one else feels like me, or Steem price won't fucking recover for a long fucking time, as people sell off at every spike.

People sell off at every spike now. What will be different? :)

The number selling off. If there are a ton trying to get it, it will crash a lot faster.

I'm not sure if a Steem headed by Steemit has a future. For a project to be successful, they need to be able to acknowledge their faults. Either we need more developers separate from Steemit or they need to change. We can't keep having issues where they just deny that they're a problem.

The same thing happened when there was an issue with bandwidth. They completely denied that there was any issue for a long ass time and when they did address it, they just did a weak ass patch to the issue, rather than adjusting the numbers, so it actually effected spammers more than just everyone with low SP.

yes this seems to be like a nightmare not like a successful launch, guess there must be some more enregy and money for development
Zwischenlinie-2 für Steem-Post 940x120.png
with sunny greetings from Andalusia
Don Thomas

How about not letting your paying customers do your R & D for you.

I have only paid with my time blogging.

Then you have still paid. I used to do 50/50; earn 50, buy 50, until VP got below 0.02. I then doubled my SP with cash. Now a single transaction of claiming rewards sets me back 59% for claiming 0.169 SP and 0.129 SBD and I can't vote for 3 days, nor can I power up the 50 Steem I still have sitting there.....

Success? This is a sorry joke! This "success" of yours is really a major fuck-up!

looking forward to the debt forgiveness! Thanks for the update guys.

test

Testing 1, 2, 3. . .

Hey, @steemitblog, et al:

At the time I'm writing this comment, about 11 hours after the hard fork went into effect, I am not yet able to do anything (this was written but posted after the fact when resource credits/mana permitted). I'm very much looking forward to the negative RCs patch.

To be honest, as I've said in earlier comments, I'm grateful for the updates, and the red banner announcement across the top of the feed and other pages is welcome, too. I can see that you folks are doing your best to make uncertainty (as in when things will start working for everyone) as informed as things possibly can be.

So, I guess you'll see this at whatever point I can post it. I'll add to it at that point with the actual time I was able to post it, which will probably be sometime tomorrow morning PDT since I probably won't wait until 11 pm PDT to see if the patch took place before that.

Not sure if you need me to tell you this, but for what it’s worth, I was able to post my first comment at around 8:30 AM PDT today, or roughly 24 hours after the hard fork took hold.

Some early observations since getting posting ability back around three hours+ ago:

  1. Very few are voting because they are afraid to lose all voting power with a single vote.
  2. Those few bigger fish that are voting don't seem to move reputation scores anymore.
  3. We need to have a way to see and understand:
    a. Our current RC power, and some idea of how fast RC power re-charges.
    b. How much each action will reduce that by, BEFORE undertaking the action.

Thanks!

There is some more information on steemd now. https://steemd.com/@mepatriot

current_mana    56,822,990,778
current_pct 9.29%

Enough credits for approximately:
5 comments (61 after recharge)
31 votes (340 after recharge)
21 transfers/powerups (226 after recharge

This is nuts. I tried to post and it said I had to buy more Steem Power to get mana. I had some Steem so I powered up 1 Steem and my mana went down. WTF.

Right so steem wants to build a social network powered by steem blockchain but yet now wants people to pay to post.......mind fucked on that one in all about powering up and supporting other creators but I don’t wanna “pay” to post

That went well...

designed to improve the user experience of small SP holders.

But right now it is doing the opposite: Small but active users could not use the system for 24 h and there voting value has been diminished to non existence.

I made one up-vote yesterday, and this morning I still have 82 hours until I can do another. This is stupid. I guess the only thing to do is to stay off steemit totally for about 4 or 5 days, come back, make an upvote then stay off steemit for another 4 or 5 days.

Indeed. And everybody seem to do that. I for one did not get any upvotes since yesterday.

Of course that also means there is not reason to make any postings for another 5 days as no one will upvote them anyway.

@steemitblog,
I was able to upvote today, now trying a comment. Thanks for the info, I look forward to the Velocity Hardfork 20!
@Lymmerik

What the heck steemit inc.??
The network is basically dead, only empty blocks for like 17 hours now:


And youre like "great success" ???<br><br>1 mln SP is not enough to make any transaction. Why are you keep saying "small SP holders" when the problem is clearly not related to the amount of SP? 99.99% of users cant use the network now, no mater how much SP they have.

And then the voting power bug. Lots of dapps and investors will lose money and you`re like "well, yeah, wait 5 days - fixed, lol"

I can understand a fuck up but calling it a success? You should clreatly state that the bug with negative RC affects basically every user and is not related to any "equilibration" but a fucked up code.

It is working fine on my end now after waiting less than the 24 hours the message said to wait, did you read that before posting this a few times?

It is not working fine.

I have 1.5 MVests (not big, not small) and manually vote / read & comment.
Now that i have mana 400 billion, instead of negative 6 quadrillion.
Commenting is taking up too much mana.

I will have to curtail my usual practices unless they make adjustments.

From my point of view, the developers made a BIG error in original computation, and now still have a LARGE error in mana computation.

(not to mention they messed up the voting %)

Indeed, lets hope for a quick fix!

this is taking far to long for the system to stabilize meanwhile our steemit it posts are dying and not being upvoted , I understand the fork was successful but users are paying a heavy price right now. And the Steem Team is doing a terrible job at informing users what is going on and lastly this okay the first day but at this point myself and plenty other steemians are losing money by the minute....how will we be reimbursted?

Its working fine for me

So your steem power is at 100% like before the HF?

I thought it was fine, i wwas voting alot

i try to keep my VP above 90% at all times. Just so i can upvote with a decent ammount of power. But that was not possible anymore. In essence steem lost 4 days of productivity. That by itself is a failure however you look at it.

Word

... ? Word ?

word up!

A success? You have got to be f-ing kidding.

Some serious thing must have happened, i am not a technical dude, you better fix it guys because that aint look good

RC Debt basically means everyone was broke except for Haejin and a few users above Orca, haha life.

Hello everyone so this is why I can not post, I'm new to steemit and I'm trying to post more I can not, it asks me to buy steemit! I thought I was free, I do not understand!

  ·  10 months ago Reveal Comment

Hey, when it will be back to normal time?

Good

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maybe we can just wait for the process to finish? in this simple way, we could also help the system from any interference if we could just give it a rest even just for a day? it's for everybody's gain if it does really work in the end, right?

What's going on with my Voting power? It's 20% without doing anything

Anyone remember that Steemit is still in Beta Testing? It says Beta right under their logo. That means it is still in transition!! If you aren't a programmer then you won't understand this. Computers do not program themselves...people program computers and computer applications. Relax and go take a walk outside or go interact with a real live person or two!

Transparency up front would have been appreciated, and telling people who wanted to post, vote, and comment to "just go outside" is a bit condescending to say the least."

Is this temporary, sir.
Did I only experience this, sir.
Especially for those of us who are at a low level and only have low steem strength and also low steem who experience this.

does this affect Steem's performance turnover later.

for your answer, we will say
Thank you sir

It is always better to speak clearly ... what day by day should I wait to start working on the platform ?????? ...

When does Steemit have a private chat interface like Messenger or Zalo, Skype? I find it necessary for the community to interact with each other more easily. When I signed up for Steem Chat, I did not know what to say and who to talk to. Because it is very crowded and confused.

You may want to join the Steemspeak server on discord (also called 'Steemfiesta'), which is not only a chatroom but also a very cool place to hang and get in touch with other steemians :-)

Here's an invitation link: https://discord.gg/agq5weK

Steem on

If you don’t want to be inundated with stupidity and poor attempts at trolling all day long, avoid SteemSpeak.

Thank you for the warning

Thanks for your developments and patches
At least you added something. Bad or good! But, I was just watching...!
Because you accepted this challenge to work on the steem blockchain. And we want to see better features.
Good luck

I don’t like this at all no wonder people are leaving. I can’t tell someone there work is good or upvote them. My auto upvote list has to be deleted now because my vp was at 89 then to 21%

As your self-appointed Steem Pope, I advise 100% manual curation anyway. People post stuff to be read and discussed, not just as a cruptocurrency factory. We need to shift to a blog mindset primarily.

Can I post yet its been dayyssss

Interesting development

Congratulations @steemitblog!
Your post was mentioned in the Steemit Hit Parade in the following category:

  • Comments - Ranked 2 with 76 comments

Now I upvote one my own post .and my voting power is now only 22%😢

i cannot post, rendeem rewards or do anything. What happened

OK, whatever Tim Steem does is definitely the best

Who in the hell had this bright idea? No voting power. What is next reducing our SP and Steem? This should never have gone live without bugs (and MAJOR bugs) being worked out. Hell I cannot even post comments, so this will probably take forever to get posted if I have the patience of trying and trying and trying... (looks like I finally was able to post this comment.

There were many hardships.
I am sure that everyone will do well in hopes of prospering.

Pretty embarrassing. Just pretend like everything is dandy? You guys dropped the ball hard. Can the community have a voice in the next HF? Can we get some notifications beforehand? Or at least some decent testing prior to implementation?

Have fun at Steemfest and keep skimming the cream up there at the top of the pyramid, because I’m starting to feel like maybe that’s what this place is all about for the devs and “whales.”

What a surprise.

Who think this is really sucessful at this time?

I do!

I don't and i can do nothing Comments, upvote etc. ..
It wasn't successful

Mm por eso no puedo publicar, y ¿ cuanto tiempo tengo que esperar para volver a publicar?, esque no entiendo muy bien porque soy nuevo

good article

Loading...

When it gonna be fixed can anyone please tell me?

Mantengamos la calma y la confianza. Es comprensible la angustia, pero debemos esperar las 24 horas a ver qué pasa.

Estamos acostumbrados a meternos en la red muchísimo tiempo y, de repente sucede que se corta el hilo, sucede la desesperación.Ánimo, users.

Ooo

It is from 14 hours on my account nothing happens, no upvote, no comments, how long we need to wait?

2 more hours at least before complaining, did you read the post?

They should have given us a heads-up well in advance.

Follow @steemitblog? They did tell us for a long time.

I don't want to be in the STEEM-centric circle. That is not my main reason to be on the blockchain. It it still their responsibility to make such changes transparent, not say, "well, you should have been watching the dev chats" after the fact. We are talking basic PR.

true and as I investigate further I am learning disturbing things... hoping they are untrue yet hard to ignore... Testnet is there for testing these things and was not utilized. I heard ned threatened the witnesses with pulling SMT development as he cannot afford to continue otherwise... ?? rumor so don't take it as gospel yet

I'm just here to watch people complain and to see how disorientated they are :))))

!popcorn time

Incredible update thanks to steemit

Since this is all new to me I read everything I found about the hardfork and the changes it would bring. Resource Credits? It sounded reasonable. And now we have Voting Mana? Okay.

Yesterday at this time I had minus 33 billion mana. Today I have a positive 546 billion. And a note that says I have:

Enough credits for approximately: 54 comments
100+ votes
100+ transfers/powerups
But only 38% voting 'mana' and 67% RCs, where before Tuesday they were both at 100%. So this is part of the equilibrium? I'm afraid to do anything with them until I understand what it all means.

Edited to add - making this comment took 2 RCs.

Steemit looks like a horrible place now. All bot vote value nearly 1/3, comment limited, vote limited, transaction limited. LOL

Are you saying that Steemit is horrible, because... the bots are not worth it now?

any other things to be known by us

It's been more than two days I have no voting power and cannot claim my curation rewards. How much longer?

This hardfork was great advertisement for Steem...
Yet again I’m losing confidence.