SteemTorch - WTF?!

in steemtorch •  10 days ago  (edited)

99pyU5Ga1kwqSXWA2evTexn6YzPHotJF8R85JZsErvtTWY9rgDUt8HFDLcTDVm9of5tHrgxh3Lvd371LK2Uxsa9uGmSL81TJdHaw6i453JEiEs5VpzHnFbc2CaeQQi5Zqx.jpg

Today I got a rather big Steem transfer: 1205 STEEM.

Memo said:

glass.wolf transfer 1,205 STEEM to rafalski Steem Torch Experiment! Count: 275. Please read the Steem Torch Rules at https://steemit.com/hive-197585/@geekgirl/steem-torch-revised before passing it to the next user. Total 1205 Steem.

And I'm confused. Cannot imagine more stupid idea right now.

Crypto was made so people wouldn't need to trust anyone, anytime, anywhere.

Yet, You have send me money with "trust" idea I will send it further.

Also consider the feelings of my fellow sender @glass.wolf if I took money for my own purposes.

I will pass on explaining why this is also stupid forcing people to follow the rules they didn't know even exist (Steemtorch rules).

I will not promote being stupid and vulnerable to scams. I'm not gonna send this money further with the rules I don't agree and didn't know before I got the steem.

Waiting for the message from the creator (@steemtorch @andrarchy) of this thing what to do - (send him back, send to null, other?).

I found out that some very noble and well know steemians participated in this action, gonna tag them to consider my point of view and why is it harmful.
@glass.wolf
@pkocjan
@rozku
@jacekw
@aggroed
@acidyo
@howo
@arcange
@themarkymark
@ausbitbank
@theycallmedan
@alexvan
@jarvie
@cryptomancer
@ocd
@mattclarke
@holoz0r
@utopian-io
@steemhunt
@partiko

"Steem Torch is an experiment to demonstrate the speed and trust in transferring value on Steem social network."

Really guys?

UPDATE: Steem returned back to the sender @glass.wolf - https://steemd.com/tx/9a1b2872991b5326bc8fb9bd8f72ac37f90514e9
WHY: my most trusted steemian friend @deepcrypto8 didnt want to take part in the "game" :(

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A truly inspired work of art =)

Thank you. <3

Where is my tin foil hat? :(

It is the best I could do man.. D:

  ·  8 days ago (edited)

this is reward pool rape, how can we get conde nast to buy steemit with content they cant censor aggrandized Male Homoerotic Hentai like that?

I've never seen anything better

  ·  8 days ago (edited)Reveal Comment

What is wrong with you?

  ·  7 days ago (edited)

I edited that comment , i dont know why it was changed back to my original edit?

Im Deeply sorry. care to show me your blockchain skills and tell me what my original post said? Are you able to show off your skills and teach us how to even do that? I heard Dan Larimer also left some secret nuggets in an old edited post of his ;)

ACkzaZoidberg1.gif

I am sorry I didnt edit my comment when I thoughT i did @nealmcspadden I really do have Tourettes and wanted to express it , but i DID edit the comment, and I was getting "transaction errors" I even posted about it somewhere, I guess I walked out of the room and forgot to finish the edit. The attempts are there im not making it up i did try to edit that first comment , i didnt intend to leave it up longer than a few mins. to prove a point , i was upset when i saw it hadnt been edited and I remember, I was getting an error. I got upset because I wasnt able to edit my own racist comment due to maybe... rate limiting?

I wrote a post about it

accept this 0.1 STEEM token as a token of my apology

Loading...

As I have been tagged, here is my reaction to your post.

This is a useless drama. As @geekgirl wrote, this is just a fun social experiment.
I am also a sort of security paranoid, but I do not find any "security" threat there.

To me, the main thing of this experiment is about trust between people (and I truly believe it won't demonstrate anything else).

The one who sent me the Steem torch money demonstrated he trusted me. If each time we needed the agreement of a person before we could show him our confidence, then the concept of trust would disappear and there would only remain that of contract.

It is the basis of inter-human relationships and it is what sets us apart from the machine.
I was honored by the trust that @emrebeyler placed in me and I think our human relationship has been strengthened. I think it was the same with @howo, to whom I transferred the money, but surely with all the people who follow the torch.

In one of your comments, you wrote:

There is plenty of scam in crypto world and I'm disgusted in such sending money to people that creates even more "area" for scams.

I think, on the contrary, that it is through our collective demonstration that trust is possible that we can reduce the scams "area". Education is not done through fear, but by leading people to adopt positive behavior.

PS: Do I need to have your consent before upvoting your posts, which triggers the system to send you STEEM you potentially could misuse according to my own values? 😉

I have over reacted because in early internet time we always have been flooded with these irritating chain messages. This chain also included money. It looks like some ponzi scheme but no by asking others to defraud but wasting own money, but still.

In theory, when you upvote, you dont want anything in return.

Hi @rafalski!

Sorry that Steem Torch experiment caused you some frustration. That was not its intent. It is a little fun social experiment to show the power of steem wallet.

When I first sent out the Steem Torch it was with purpose to show how fast and reliable Steem blockchain is in transferring funds. Steem Torch travelled around the world, users from all continents got to send to each other with zero fees. That is one of the great features of Steem. As you said with blockchain there is no need to trust centralized entities, money transfers can be done peer to peer more securely and efficiently. Steem is more than capable of that. That is the essence of the experiment.

Of course social layer adds the trust in people, who on Steem are awesome. Steem Torch passed through users who are whales, orcas, dolphins, minnows, and even users with 15 sp. That just shows how trustworthy and awesome community we have. It is something we can be proud about.

The experiment has been going on for 11 months without any broken trust. Hopefully it will end successfully when it reaches the final count and the the funds will be donated for some good cause by the final count user.

Once again apologies that it bothered you. Just wanted to explain the original intentions. Clearly, you are invested in Steem and have projects going on and believe in the potential of Steem. Transfer of value in Steem is one of its great features. The experiment just demonstrates that.

No scams, no ill intentions here. Quite the opposite. Thank you for not ending it.

I'm sitting here flabbergasted by the logic presented in this post. It really makes very little sense to me.

I'm pretty sure there are a few Steemian's following the torch who would feel honored to receive it and pass it along, yet some are actually offended to receive it? My mind is blown..

PS. I'm gonna try a little experiment here. I became motivated after receiving some ENGAGE tokens from @joshman, so I decided to acquire the required amount for distribution. So, gonna try it out right now, you're my fist :)

!ENGAGE 50

PEOPLE ARE PASSING A MONETIZED MEMO TO EACH OTHER OUT OF GOOD WILL?!

OH THE HUMANITY!!!

YOU SENT ME STEEM AND EXPECT ME TO SEND IT ON TO SOMEONE ELSE?!

I'M BEING OPPRESSED!!!!!!

😂
!ENGAGE 50



@joshman you have received 50 ENGAGE from @futuremind!
View and trade the tokens on Steem Engine.


This tip bot is powered by witness untersatz!

Thank you @futuremind!



@geekgirl you have received 50 ENGAGE from @futuremind!
View and trade the tokens on Steem Engine.


This tip bot is powered by witness untersatz!

I was actually auto-upvoting your posts to support your https://steemweb.pl project. Since there is no contract, it's completely reliant on trust, but you're making it very clear that you're not believing in trust. So, should I stop my autovotes and unvote this post?

Exactly.

id like to give you a sentiment token for "Aggrandizement" or "Momentary Power Play" as @whatsup calls it

  ·  9 days ago Reveal Comment

Hell.. Send it to Steem-Roller.com and double it on the dice, keep half of it and send the rest to wherever you want.. Profit. :D

lol, I mean personally I don't think you should do that but whatever!

Taking the STEEM Torch for yourself would be a dick move.. But it is yours to do what you want with it. Interested to see what you do.

It is not the point, I don't want to keep it at all.

Send it here then man. I'll send it to someone who will pass it on. Not a big deal.

You must be really fun at parties huh?

I recieved money and I'm soooo mad!!!

i read that in rick's voice

:)

Every person who had it, enjoyed the opportunity to steal it, burn it or pass it on.

I don't think it was about trust at all it was about a voluntary participation in a community event.

I can see your point, if you send it back where it came from, no big deal, if you send it to null you've made a decision for everyone and some are likely to have feelings about it.

Feels like a momentary power play perhaps not worthy of the lash back, but that depends on how strongly you feel about your point.

Excuse me but what is Life but not a series of "Momentary power plays" What the fuck is every steem post but a momentary power play? Trump America Twitter its all just 15 mins of fame in a smart contract now pay your fucking immutable smart taxes and shut up lol democratic primaries are on

anyway im enjoying your twitter and thats how i found this

Oh and also didnt you know likwid was downvoting people for not downvoting people?

Every person who had it, enjoyed the opportunity to steal it, burn it or pass it on.

That is what I don't like about it too.

Sounds like you are a control freak. Any way, best of luck

No, just cyber security freak.

How does that explain this drama queen episode where you considered keeping it? You were never at risk.

LOL WAIT CYBER SECURITY RISK WOT?

not security just governance come on man

You don't like the freedom to choose what to do in a situation?

Weird flex, but ok. :D

How you can enjoy opportunity to steal?

Easily.. Is a simple test of ones character really.

You either steal it, or you don't. * shrugs *

Anytime one can prove themselves to be a bit better than what most expect of them I find it thrilling. Perhaps I am strange though.. Tis up to you man. :D

How do you feel when u send it to the person who then steal it?

I mean, it fucking sucks for the people who enjoy watching the thing get passed around, but at the end of the day the probability of someone embezzling it isn't zero.. So eventually it will happen.

Not really going to be surprised when someone takes the STEEM or burns it.. Am interested to see who the person is who does this though.

Personally find it amusing to see how people react when sent the STEEM. Most just add some and pass it on to other people.

  ·  9 days ago (edited)

There is also a meta level in this game. Usually the torch is passed to a friend and somebody, where it is not expected that the money gets lost. The whole community is watching the torch pass. You really make a valid point about trust and extra rules I agree with. Anyone who puts money into this topples up the value, has to expect to lose the money in the long run. It is destined to fail in the long run because Murphy´s law. But maybe the social interaction we all had on Steem frontends was worth more than 1200 steem, the more value, the more suspence, more talk about the torch. If the money gets lost, nothing will happen on blockchain protocol level, it will just trigger a social whale witchhunt onto the untrustworthy account. But I dont want to bother you with What-if Scenario I am sure you will either return it sender or pass on to somebody you expect he will not rob the community. Cheers !

morpheus-grin.gif

  ·  8 days ago (edited)

nothing will happen on blockchain protocol level

.... but

NFTs....... N F T orch?

That is the point, I don't want to keep it but I could, right? There is plenty of scam in crypto world and I'm disgusted in such sending money to people that creates even more "area" for scams.

So are you gonna be the guy that pulls the scam then, or you gonna pass it on? lmao

I've got a bet on what happens and am awaiting the outcome. :D

Yup, but its social interaction that counts here not the money. And please dont let klye or some other known troll trigger you into the wrong decision @rafalski. Thank you I like math and probabilistic oriented problems too, thats why i can understand your point very well.

^ elgeko owes me 10 STEEM if you embezzle the STEEM.

I owe him 10 STEEM if you send it to someone else.

Do what you want rafalski. Either way I find this entertaining. :D

I could send it to my trusted friend deepcrypto8..

Do it! :D

Shhhhhh.. I don't think rafalski knows I'm STEEM satan yet.. :D

in-bird-culture.jpg

A man who stopped the Torch and moved the Steemians ;-)
Well deserved:

!dramatoken

Fuck sake. Keep it or don't but don't be a fucking crybaby about it

Being made to participate in an action, when not asked to participate, (in anything!) is not an immature response.
(it's coercion, one way or another)

It's about the principle, not the money.

hello again, btw! lol

  ·  9 days ago (edited)

What's so confusing? It is just a bit of community fun. You don't have to send a greater amount, so it's not like it matters to you.

The only responsibility was on the person sending it to you to have some idea that you would 1. Find it funny and not bothersome and 2. Send it on to someone else.

Your comment about the point of crypto being to not have to trust anyone also makes no sense as it relates to the protocol and ownership of your own wallet and funds, not to what people and communities do with their money or resources.

  ·  9 days ago (edited)

as it relates to the protocol and ownership of your own wallet and funds, not to what people and communities do with their money or resources

I disagree. Such behavour develops more scamish vulnerability of the person. One day it is "I will send you sth, send it further, it's a nice game" and another day it is "Lend me some money, I will send it back later".

From me - big NO NO NO.

Yet you're fine with delegated proof of stake? Isn't that trust in 20 people? So, which is it?

But, you make a fair point. There was no agreement prior to the transfer. Personally, I wouldn't hold it against you if you kept it or did whatever.

I don't want to hold it. I don't need it.

Then either return it to the person who sent it to you, pass it to whoever else seems to care, or send it to @null for fun and as something that is actually good for STEEM

'Consent' is a wonderful word.

So is 'gushing'.... but that's not relevant right now.

!giphy drama




giphy is supported by witness untersatz!

Isn't it what steem is about?

Rafalski right now

You couldnt be more right :D

Send to null!
Send to null!

You got it all wrong mate, but it's my fault. I didn't follow the rules and didn't ask you or inform you about the transfer. I trust you so i've just sent you the torch. Your attitude is totally understandable, because i kinda forced you to participate and i am sorry for that, but also a bit amused. Jah Bless!

Okay, thanks for 1205 steem.

yeah, or send it further or back and i'll send it to someone else, don't spoil the game just because you think it's stupid

will send it back to you if "game" inventor doesn't respond

  ·  8 days ago (edited)

hes not spoiling the game hes actually pointing out why steem sucks when they are in any way trying to competing with real BTC lightening network with their paddy cake pass the steemn shit,

like seriously we should be building NFT EOSTEEM smart contract with steem + telos + EOSIO and make THAT a torch not this fraud theyre doing now with steem torch that has no basis in reality just a circle jerk a literal embodiment of a circlejerk. sure elgekos words have some merit but still he would probably love to see it become a real NFT instead and build these social YABB crap into the chain lets not have some hot potato game like a preschool and watch to see "Who violates the trust first' lol

MAYBE if someone had made a new NFT token and cool front end for the torch thatd be one thing if it had liek a map and a site that let you show teh custom jsons and the users etc etc blah blah but nah it was a lazy excersize

Someone should instead make NFT Steem Engine TORCH

Look at all the NFTs
https://steem-engine.rocks/nfts

Why no STEEM TORCH NFT!?!?!?!!

we even have BTCP on steem use that shit, get us BTCP tips on the front end not stupid steem torch bull shit

the way steemians acted like our cute lil "torch" was in anyway comparable to bitcoin was insulting to actual blockchain developers who the mainstream steem regime totally deny access to, theyll be hostile to anything that isnt a steem dapp, fucking pathetic steem maximalists.

^^ this^^ is the point.
At last, some one gets it.

I read the post about 3 times and I still don't understand why you should make a post instead of just returning the money to the person who sent it to you before (you could even include a memo saying that you just don't want to participate or you think it's stupid).

All this is unnecessary.

I don't know.. because it's social platform? :)

You're really making a big deal out of it tbh. Nobody's forcing you to do SHIT.

Excellent information

I made this same comment on @klye's post, but feel its relevant here as a standalone..

Insert drama here.

The original Steem Torch was a stuffed bird named Rustle.

https://steempeak.com/@holoz0r/spare-a-thought-for-rustle-the-original-steemtorch


You have DRAMA!

To view or trade DRAMA go to steem-engine.com.