RE: Steemit is a Popularity Contest for the 1% Whales
Bloggers you want to come here to
get paid for your contentGET PAID FOR YOUR POPULARITY (but first you must have mega steem power) and jump through our hoops to do that [...]
You're absolutely correct, it's a popularity contest, and obviously the simplest course of action to get high rewards is to appeal to those with the most SP, the whales. So really the original statements stands "Get paid for your content" and should be qualified with "Payment is based on popularity (number of votes), and proportional to Steem Power of voters".
The difference from a clever meme of @kingscrown with little text is outrageous compared to the photo manipulated post of @son-of-satire that deserves far more reward then pocket change.
The problem with post "quality" is that it's subjective. There may be some very common norms of quality, but that simply does not apply here. This is because Steem(it) is not designed to reward good quality content, rather rewards are an incentive to produce what the community wants, what is in demand. We might hope that what is in demand is "high quality" content, but if people like funny memes, that's what they'll get.
What I identify as the main issue you bring up is that whales have too much power relative to minnows, and I tentatively agree. There are a lot who agree with you. But that's the way it is. Steem Power is Steem Power. The question is what can we do about it?
So ideally, there'd be some way to curb Steem Power it is was unpopular with a large proportion of users. This is how it works in real life when we're lucky. The powerful have to cowtow to the masses in someway, unless they're very good at manipulating them, because pressure can be exerted on them by shear numbers, and by the fact that usually power is premised on at least tacit permission from the masses.
With the current system probably the best way to do that is some kind of minnows unite type system. I proposed an app that could help minnows organize when so-called abusive flagging happens. That and boycotts, and other less savory tactics like flagging all their posts, comment spamming them, etc. etc. to more or less shame them until "good" whales notice and do something.
With a change to the system? I don't know, a lot has been proposed and I'm out of ideas ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I find myself defending the original idea a lot, not because I agree with it, but because it makes sense, or in other words, it is a coherent system. I have to reject ideas premised on false assumptions, like that Steemit is designed for quality content, and others should weigh these up too. Steemit may not be the place people thought it was, or that people want, and it will live or die on that.
If popularity of the 1% whales is what Steemit is then it needs to be promote on the internet that Steemit is a popularity contest. I bet you'll get a lot of valued content from that tag line! We will never see Steemit go public with that and why?? > Because the founders wanted "good content" to bless their block chain. Not women in scant clothes, or everyone bowing to a few 1% whales. I am not addressing the issue of SP and whales I am putting the focus on the 1% SPA (Steem Powered Abuser) whales. Noooo I don't have to accept this kind of behavior or watch my Steemian friends go through it.
I noticed that a lot of these subjective voting whales have no friends and some have no content. What that tells me is the community is not important but something else is. Viewing content and getting involved in the community of minnows, dolphins or lower SP whales with good content will corrupt the 1% whales vision of a popularity contest for 1% whales only.
What I am getting from the founders of Steemit is nothing what the 1% SPA whales are spouting out for us to swallow. No thanks. Maybe at one time some of these 1% whales caught the vision of the founders but not many in the communityh see these 1% whales as being too healthy for the community.
As far as value being subjective I'm sure if these SP 1% whales were at an auction (with their own money to spend) they would get instant FM! Freekin' Magic! They would get the best value for their buck. Sorry, I'm not being smacked down with all this Steemit popularity contest crapola for the 1% gang.
If you noted above I had two memes to look at because memes were popular at that time. I didn't say one shouldn't have gotten paid over $70 dollars for their meme I said to look at the difference and see that a talented artist only took home pocket change for their finely manipulated funny meme. This is a no brainer and so extreme of an example how the 1% whales don't even bother to look at the community's content.
These 1% whales can't, even, see how the community sees their actions and how estranged theyh are. It makes sense the 1% whales would downvote creative content> They are out of touch > It's screaming to the community > TAKE CARE OF THIS BEFORE IT BLEEDS STEEMIT DRY!
"This is because Steem(it) is not designed to reward good quality content, rather rewards are an incentive to produce what the community wants, what is in demand. We might hope that what is in demand is "high quality" content, but if people like funny memes, that's what they'll get."
EVERYONE WHO IS READING THIS are you seeing what is being said here? If you don't see below the translation:
"This is because Steem(it) is not designed to reward good quality content, rather rewards are an incentive to produce what the SP 1% whales want, what the 1% whale demand. We might hope that what is in demand is "high quality" content, but if the whales want their 1% whale memes to get $100 and a minnow or dolphin to get pocket change, that's what the community will get."
ARE YOU KIDDING ME? That isn't SP that is SPA Steem Power Abuse. This Is Unacceptable in so many different ways.
Yes, this is how the world works when I was a child but now I am an adult and I don't subject myself under these kinds of conditions. No one has to be treated with disrepect and to work hard for something to get nothing when promised all because a few whales demand control with their SP. If Steemit is a SP Whale contest NOBODY TOLD ME or the rest of this community. No 1% SPA whale is going to muzzle me/downvote me or tell me I have to leave. Dan and Ned made this for everyone not just the 1% SPA whales.
I propose people in this community stand up for themselves and others who are afraid of these 1% SPA whales (especially the newbies and elderly ladies.) Create your own content exposing your experience when they downvote/are Rude/abusive. Dig into the posts, wallets, who they vote for and get an idea and discuss what they are doing. Bring things to the light with dignity and an attitude of win/win/win will make a difference. Maybe some 1% whales will come to their sences and give up controlling steemit community.
For me it all started with @karenmckersie. These SPA 1% whales exposed who they are to the community when they struck her down and mocked her and was rude. THIS WOKE US UP.
As far as the original idea > It never came from the SP 1% whales it came from the founders. Thank the higher powers for @Ned and @Dan .
To be fair, I feel that you're treating me with disrespect here by shouting in all caps and putting words in my mouth by "translating" what i said. No one should be treated with disrespect but if / when they are, it's up to other people to defend them and stand with them. Ideally the system would but it's not the case here on Steem(it). There are no moderators, and that ties into the anti-censorship attributes of the system.
Nothing is promised. All voting is voluntary. A few whales do not "demand control with their SP", they are entitled to it by the rules of the system. The sooner this is widely understood, the sooner we can move on to find a solution.
I can agree with you on this, and think you should follow your own advice.
I am sorry that you feel disrepected. That is not what I wanted to convey. Thank you for taking the time to comment and what I was saying should not have been directed to you but the focuss of my post. What you were saying made sense and I found it helpful to translate what I was seeing and feeling through your words. It was extremely helpful in my process in trying to understand what is going on. I will be more aware of the caps. Yes, you are right I do need to follow my own advice. Thanks for the reminder.
As far as SP whale downvoting and upvoting I disagree and find it manipulates the community. At least from the research I've done so far. I am open to change and thank you again for your insight.
Cool 😇
It's a hot topic for sure, I think the argument is strong that whales have too much power relative to minnows. This disparity could be reduced without undermining the system or by doing a complete rethink, i.e. without imposing arbitrary rules on how people should vote. It could be something agreeable to everyone. I'd probably vote for it myself given the chance, but would like to see more debate about it from a technical point of view.
Thanks for your reply 🙂
I will have to disagree with you. I don't want anything capped or take Steem Power, currency or recognition from whales. Especially, the whales that have no part in the negative actions of these few SPA whales toward the community. From what I can see most whales do not act badly towards the community of creators that work hard to monotize, get noticed and Steemit Power. I don't know. Call me naive I just don't know who is a part of it all.
In the world this happens too. A few bad apple's/criminal's actions towards the community wind up to have more laws passed to take away more things from the community. That's a fail/fail action and everyone loses. I thought Steemit was different and it should be different it was promoted differently by the founders. The problem is not SP, whales or both. The problem is the actions of a few whales who thinks the community works for them only. I am sure these SPA whales have done good things to help make Steemit a better place. Why shouldn't they when Steemit and the hard working creators are making them money. So, these few SP 1% whales stating they've done so much for Steemit is true but their intent for doing so is different from Steemit/community. Stating these 1% whales put out good content and should get rewarded is, also, not being disputed. That is not the focus it's about the community, good content vs 1% SPA whales popularity contest and their intent of manipulating the system to their advantage. When you carefuly read through smooth's post it's nothing like the vision of ned and dan and in the comments they put down @dan for not seeing their side of their vision. A vision of a popularity contest. Do you remember high school and how that whole system worked? The popular kiids ruled the school and now these few 1% whales think they rule Steemit community and the reward pool. Who in their creative mind would want to waste their time on anything like that. Bloggers, artists, photographers, singers, creators would rather work at facebook or the many others social media platforms. I came here because it was promoted differently not like a scam.
[Thread depth reached, in response to your latest comment]
I think I've already made my argument about popularity being the original idea, etc. etc so won't restate it.
On whale power disparity, all I'm suggesting is that reducing the relative difference in power between a low power user and a high power user would make things fairer. Specially, it means that people coming to the "rescue" or in defence of others would have more ability to do it at the lower levels of SP.
The only alternative I see is introducing some kind of moderation. I would oppose this. Others have suggested ideas for it though, such as a council of some sort and you might find more common ground with them than me.
The problem is with SP and whales. Whales have a lot by definition, and that is power and influence on this platform. Limiting what they can do with that power is against the freedom / anti-censorship ethos, and also introduces the problem of deciding how, why and when to restrict that power. I see the only viable solution is to reduce the massive power disparity. Otherwise we're looking at complex conditional rules, like a legal system, or councils, which will probably introduce corruption - or simply doing nothing and asking them to be nice.
I'll quote from the whitepaper pg 18 to show something that the founders actually agree with (or once did) instead of speculating:
Reducing the power gap will make the walls more slippery.
All that said, I'm still not 100% convinced the "problem" is something that can't be solved by mass minnow collusion to upvote overly, abusively or unfairly flagged posts. My Helping Hand idea could still be useful for this.
You are far more knowledgable on what is going on than I am, I'm sure, and I would hope we wouldn't have to use monitors, councils, have continuous voting war(s). I am hoping the community can do this on their own. Maybe we need to learn how to stand up, unite (minnows, dolphins and whales) to abusive whales who manipulate. Supporting great blogs that got the touch of death to be ignored by those few that want to continue their rule. There are steemians that need the community's support and we steemians need to stop waiting for someone else to take care of this problem. Those who don't will sooner or later need help.