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RE: That de-escalated Sweetsss-ly

in #newsteem5 years ago

和聪明人说话应该简单一些,我们打开天窗说亮话

@honeybee, @sweetsssj You're right

Vote selling is economically equivalent to self voting/circle jerking etc. Fully self voting takes 100% of the voting rewards and puts it in the stakeholders pocket. Vote selling takes 100% of the voting rewards and distributes it between the between the stakeholder, bid bot owner and vote buyer, the latter 2 arguably even less deserving than the stakeholder. Vote selling arguably does my damage as it messes with trending in the process of siphoning money out the back door, the others are just the latter.

OCDB happens to be ran at 0 profit (including curation I think), so the owners don't get anything from it. But you're also right that it does just as much harm to the system irrespective of it's altruism. We all pay the price when OCDB kicks up 1400-2200 Steem a day to freedom, regardless of whether it takes a cut. It all contributes to content indifferent voting that undermines proof of brain.

And I'm sure you're also smart enough to know that blacklists/whitelists don't do shit. Either they're just empty virtue signalling and don't increase standards at all, or they actually increase standards and lose business to other voting bots with lower standards.

Pre HF21 when curation was 25%, curve was linear and there were no free downvotes, fighting against this was futile. Why would I or anyone spend voting mana downvoting abusers when it just meant the majority of the money reclaimed into the pool will go to other abusers? The only rational move other than selling the investment entirely is to join in on the abuse. And the common knowledge of this prevented the system from self correcting. To put it bluntly, the economic incentives pre HF21 were fucking retarded. And sticking to them for over 2 years was doubly retarded.

But here's the thing:

With curation bumped up to 50%, 25% free downvotes and the slightly superlinear curve, things are very different. Sure 50% is not as high as 100%, but with all the downvotes floating around that will disproportionally target abuse, as well as middle men needing a cut too, there's not that much wiggle room for this kind of abuse anymore. Hiding your votes is also more difficult because if they're too small you just get taxed by the curve. It's been less than a week and bid bots are really feeling the pinch. Some of the biggest ones are packing up shop and pivoting to curation https://steemit.com/smartsteem/@smartsteem/new-feature-request-a-curation-review-by-burning-steem-and-sbd. They're also using their downvotes to fight abuse, similar to OCDB (who have told me they're not going to be doing this bid bot shit for much longer either)

Similarly a lot of self voters like me who felt they had no choice back then have recognized that it's no longer futile against abuse and have turned to 100% honest curation and using every bit of free downvote power we can to put a stop to content indifferent voting behavior (circle jerks, vote sellers etc).

We would like your help. I would like your help. For the first time in Steem's history we have a sensible (but admittedly crude and can easily be improved) set of economic incentives that doesn't punish honest curators the most. If we win, we can implement a largely honest curation norm on here where most people settle for 50% curation rewards and keep each other in check from stepping out of line and being greedy.

Have a look around you and see which way the wind is blowing. OCDB is already up your ass, you can try to hide in other voting circles, sell your votes, or you can step up and join me and fight for the integrity of the platform. 50% returns is pretty nice, more if you curate well. No drama, no hassle, just a very fun empowering feeling curating for what's deserving and fucking over what's not.

朋友,和我并肩作战吧!I could really use your help

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I have been the recipient of down votes because as you know, proof of brain does not cross the mind of people who support content indifferent schemes and now it is clear, it works both ways - voting as well as down voting.

I do not speak on behalf of anyone but myself and I simply point out the hypocrisy of selling votes, undermining proof of brain and then using delegate power to content indifferent down vote.

I support proof of brain and 100% honest duration. I do not support those who cower behind charitable schemes who clearly do benefit from running bid bots. A cursory look at the op, ocdb, acidyo and a few others will show there is pretty much a voting circle happening there too.

If we are to implement 100% curation, then I cannot support anyone who participates in as you say content indifferent voting. If we want to fight this together, then a consistent line of logic must be followed, no exceptions.

Those who delegate to bid bots and rent seek should not receieve honest curation. Same goes for anyone who runs a bid bot.

I will contact you to speak about this privately if you let me know how to contact you.

I agree with pretty much everything you say

Even if a bid bot operator does not take any fee, he is still contributing to 100% content indifferent voting behavior. All that money is then extracted from the system and passed onto the sellers. The damage is the same whether the intermediary takes a cut or not.

Now it use to be pre HF21 that stakeholders would only make a quarter as much curating honestly as they would abusing (vote selling, circle jerking, self voting etc). No surprise pretty much all active stake ended up doing it and completely undermined the entire POB system.

Now with the new incentives in place, curation is a healthy 50%, and with all the free downvotes floating around, it's probably better just to vote honestly and help fight abuse.

Acid has already told me he plans to go full curation in the near future. I believe him. Smartsteem is making a move in that direction too, and will attempt to do that for smartmarket as well. That's ballpark 20m SP converting to curation from content indifferent behavior (actual numbers will vary of course, but it's definitely something.)

Please play a part in honest curation now. If most people settled for 50% returns from honest curation, it actually benefits us all the most. And from how things are looking, we're heading in that direction.

See if you can convince @sweetsssj to give it a chance and do the same. Fight against abuse like vote selling and other content indifferent behavior like I do. If we're no longer abusing the system, why should other people get to?

It's been less than 2 weeks but things are looking palpably better. Persuade your circle in playing a bigger part. And if we can install a broadly honest set of voting behaviors platform wide, over time I believe it'll be reflected in the Steem price.

I have a discord. tarazkp there too.

But, you are welcome to talk here too.

Have a look around you and see which way the wind is blowing. OCDB is already up your ass, you can try to hide in other voting circles, sell your votes, or you can step up and join me and fight for the integrity of the platform.

Nicely said.

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