All life is killing. Even herbivores like deer, horses and cows will kill and eat birds, rabbits and mice. Most vertebrates depend upon, or are willing to eat other animals.
It's part of nature.
Even plants will eat animals if they get a chance. In fact, they could not live if animals didn't die on them, rot down into their roots, and return the phosphorous they need to grow and can't get elsewhere.
Killing and dying is not the worst thing. Disrupting the cycle of a biosphere by refusing to kill or die is the worst thing.
...and when you eat fruit, you are promoting life, not taking it :) Become a REAL human: a better human! Humans need not kill, and that is what makes the human species amazing.
We removed millions of herd animals off the land, killed their predators, monocropped their land destroying the biome, and ground the grain into flour to replace our natural food sources. And you only see the last 10 days of the disruption? One hamburger more or less makes that all just fine?
We are the apex predator. We displace wolves and sharks. We need to do their job. Those herd animals should be back on their fields. The only non-totalitarian way to get them there is to buy and eat pastured meats.
"We are the apex predator. We displace wolves and sharks. We need to do their job" - Wow. There's doing their job and there's going too far. I think we've done the latter.
Well, we have certainly done their job wrong. Allan Savory's methods are more like this, where wolves changed the habits of prey and caused an ecological recovery.
That's only been true in the last 10000 years or so (grain agriculture). Just because we are doing it wrong doesn't mean there is no right way to do it. Learn and grow, it's the human way.
And in the meantime we are allowed to kill massively and as we see fit. No, I don't buy it.
Killing animals for food is plain wrong. Killing humans is plain wrong too. Yes, this is comparable! Does killing humans also fit under learn and grow excuse?
@baerdric wild animals kill for survival, humans kill for pleasure. Big difference. Humans are opportunistic omnivores. We ate other animals as a survival mechanism. Today we have a choice not to and enjoy the multiple benefits that come with a compassionate plant based lifestyle.
I highly advise you visit a slaughter house to witness first hand who is disrupting what.
Which humans kill for pleasure? Less than 1%. Most kill for food. I suggest you visit some developing nations to learn what humans really do outside of the corporate brainwashing of the Megafarms who want you to eat food that is cheaper to make, more profitable to sell, easier to store and transport, causes diseases they can treat but not cure, and domesticates the populace with estrogeniods.
@baerdric even Vegans will eat animals if there were no plants! But thankfully we don't need to, we live in a world in which we can grow our own food like myself with just water in over 85 pots. Or one can buy from the supermarket. As for animals needing to die in order forplants to grow on that soil...This spring as I was driving from Vegas to LA, we had had so much rain that I'm pretty sure I sure grass growing all over the dessert...in between the other plants that is. I was shocked to be honest, and I still dont know how it's possible. I mean it was green grass and a lot of it!
Not really sure it has any significance, 91% of the Amazon has been chopped down for animal agriculture because people like have decided they like a flavour! My childs existence has been put at risk because of ignorant people like yourself who don't educate themselves! We are as individuals responsible. No government forces meat down the necks of humans. Each and every person is responsible for their actions. Only problem is, my family has to live with the consequences of your need to murder. Then when we say anything we're labeled as a cult or whackos. We are somehow the nutters for wanting to save the earth! Can you understand where I'm coming from? Eating meat is not needed and there is no such way of humane killing. To kill is to kill end of story. That's the issue though with the majority of all you sheep. You search for excuses and ways to get around things. Open your eyes, accept that your local farmer fantasy shall never be a reality! They don't kill 58 billion animals for fun, they do it for profit! There isnt even enough space for 58 billion animals to be grazing in the fields. It's only you that would somehow feel better if you could say, ah me, I only buy local grass fed beef that the farmer has massaged daily and put humanely to rest. It's a fantasy because you would like to be a nice person but fact is, you participate in mass destruction. Again we are responsible, me and you! Please wake up.
You dont need to be educated, but still I'm happy for you. Start by sending facts. Links to organisations that are not sponsored by the meat industry. And please calculate the current demand of 58 billion. Not your fantasy of my local farmer. Where are you putting 58 billion animals. Also explain why it's fine to murder 58 billion animals. I'm deeply interested to understand how you think because for me it's mind boggling how you view the opposite when 92% of just the amazon has gone. Im not mentioning usa. I'm haven't even mentioned the top 12 causes of death in the USA. So explain, maybe write your own post and I'll vote it up for your time and effort.
All life is killing. Even herbivores like deer, horses and cows will kill and eat birds, rabbits and mice. Most vertebrates depend upon, or are willing to eat other animals.
It's part of nature.
Even plants will eat animals if they get a chance. In fact, they could not live if animals didn't die on them, rot down into their roots, and return the phosphorous they need to grow and can't get elsewhere.
Killing and dying is not the worst thing. Disrupting the cycle of a biosphere by refusing to kill or die is the worst thing.
...and when you eat fruit, you are promoting life, not taking it :) Become a REAL human: a better human! Humans need not kill, and that is what makes the human species amazing.
@ Finally the heavens have opened up. If you don't want to harm plants because of their feelings then help the plant and eat its fruit!
Sorry, I don't get it. If I refuse to eat a cow which was, supposedly, killed for my benefit, how am I disrupting the cycle of a biosphere?
We removed millions of herd animals off the land, killed their predators, monocropped their land destroying the biome, and ground the grain into flour to replace our natural food sources. And you only see the last 10 days of the disruption? One hamburger more or less makes that all just fine?
We are the apex predator. We displace wolves and sharks. We need to do their job. Those herd animals should be back on their fields. The only non-totalitarian way to get them there is to buy and eat pastured meats.
"We are the apex predator. We displace wolves and sharks. We need to do their job" - Wow. There's doing their job and there's going too far. I think we've done the latter.
Well, we have certainly done their job wrong. Allan Savory's methods are more like this, where wolves changed the habits of prey and caused an ecological recovery.
We are not the apex predator. We are disruptor.
That's the whole point - being with the nature or against the nature. Killing millions of stock animals for food is against the nature.
We are pretending to be better than the nature. We are not!
We are pretending to know and play our role. We are presumptuous. We are vane.
The original sin of the (western) civilization is constant fight against the nature.
Nature doesn't care about us. Give or take several hundred thousand years we will be history. The nature will still be here.
Even if we destroy this planet from human point of view sooner or later the nature will fix itself.
We humans are not the solution. We are the problem!
That's only been true in the last 10000 years or so (grain agriculture). Just because we are doing it wrong doesn't mean there is no right way to do it. Learn and grow, it's the human way.
And in the meantime we are allowed to kill massively and as we see fit. No, I don't buy it.
Killing animals for food is plain wrong. Killing humans is plain wrong too. Yes, this is comparable! Does killing humans also fit under learn and grow excuse?
@baerdric wild animals kill for survival, humans kill for pleasure. Big difference. Humans are opportunistic omnivores. We ate other animals as a survival mechanism. Today we have a choice not to and enjoy the multiple benefits that come with a compassionate plant based lifestyle.
I highly advise you visit a slaughter house to witness first hand who is disrupting what.
Which humans kill for pleasure? Less than 1%. Most kill for food. I suggest you visit some developing nations to learn what humans really do outside of the corporate brainwashing of the Megafarms who want you to eat food that is cheaper to make, more profitable to sell, easier to store and transport, causes diseases they can treat but not cure, and domesticates the populace with estrogeniods.
@baerdric even Vegans will eat animals if there were no plants! But thankfully we don't need to, we live in a world in which we can grow our own food like myself with just water in over 85 pots. Or one can buy from the supermarket. As for animals needing to die in order forplants to grow on that soil...This spring as I was driving from Vegas to LA, we had had so much rain that I'm pretty sure I sure grass growing all over the dessert...in between the other plants that is. I was shocked to be honest, and I still dont know how it's possible. I mean it was green grass and a lot of it!
Learn about the phosphorus cycle and get back to me.
Not really sure it has any significance, 91% of the Amazon has been chopped down for animal agriculture because people like have decided they like a flavour! My childs existence has been put at risk because of ignorant people like yourself who don't educate themselves! We are as individuals responsible. No government forces meat down the necks of humans. Each and every person is responsible for their actions. Only problem is, my family has to live with the consequences of your need to murder. Then when we say anything we're labeled as a cult or whackos. We are somehow the nutters for wanting to save the earth! Can you understand where I'm coming from? Eating meat is not needed and there is no such way of humane killing. To kill is to kill end of story. That's the issue though with the majority of all you sheep. You search for excuses and ways to get around things. Open your eyes, accept that your local farmer fantasy shall never be a reality! They don't kill 58 billion animals for fun, they do it for profit! There isnt even enough space for 58 billion animals to be grazing in the fields. It's only you that would somehow feel better if you could say, ah me, I only buy local grass fed beef that the farmer has massaged daily and put humanely to rest. It's a fantasy because you would like to be a nice person but fact is, you participate in mass destruction. Again we are responsible, me and you! Please wake up.
I understand what you are saying. I understood long ago. You're just wrong.
Here's the thing. I am well educated on both sides of the issue, you barely understand one side and get most of that wrong.
You dont need to be educated, but still I'm happy for you. Start by sending facts. Links to organisations that are not sponsored by the meat industry. And please calculate the current demand of 58 billion. Not your fantasy of my local farmer. Where are you putting 58 billion animals. Also explain why it's fine to murder 58 billion animals. I'm deeply interested to understand how you think because for me it's mind boggling how you view the opposite when 92% of just the amazon has gone. Im not mentioning usa. I'm haven't even mentioned the top 12 causes of death in the USA. So explain, maybe write your own post and I'll vote it up for your time and effort.
I totally agree with you!