Why Am I Such a Fan of DPOS Blockchains Like STEEM and BitShares?

in #cryptocurrency3 years ago

http://blocktivity.info/ has the answer:

STEEM is not even using a single percent of its current network capacity:

Where as Bitcoin... well:

It's getting hammered.

IMO, BitShares and STEEM are not getting the love they deserve:

This needs to be repeated over and over again until more people get it.

STEEM is an amazing cryptocurrency.

  • Zero fees.

  • 3 second block confirmation times.

  • Energy efficient with DPOS (Delegated Proof of Stake) block production which is collaborative instead of competitive (unlike POW: Proof of Work).

Once more people realize this, we could see much high prices. On top of that (almost as an afterthought) the STEEM blockchain also supports amazing social media sites like steemit which currently has a global Alexa ranking of 2,085.

Bitcoin vs. Bitcoin Cash: Irrelevant?

There's been a lot of debate about Bitcoin Segwit vs. Bitcoin Cash and so far I haven't really weighed in on the discussion much. I really enjoyed this article by SFOX Is Bigger Better? How to Evaluate Bitcoin Cash Based on Block Size which made me realize why I haven't been so interested in the debate. It's not just about bigger blocks. In many ways, it's about how POW simply can't meet the demands we're putting on blockchains today. When digital kitties can make the Ethereum network unusable, clearly we have a problem.

This @steemitblog post did an excellent job explaining how this wouldn't be an issue for STEEM at all: Digital Kitties on Steem? How would the Steem blockchain handle 700,000 transactions per day?

Yes, I may think Bitcoin Cash is technically closer to the original Satoshi vision where block sizes are increased to keep the mempool unfilled to facilitate the "Electronic Cash System" outlined in the original paper. I see the conflict between the miners and the users where the miners are incentivized to increase the transaction fees at the expense of the users. That said, it's no longer strictly "peer-to-peer" (in terms of IP-based) like it once was either. Additionally, comparing a current version of a technology in a fast-moving space to its original might be like comparing a Tesla to a Model T Ford. You might argue a Tesla isn't true to the original vision of a car because it lacks an internal combustion engine, but I'd still prefer having a Tesla. :)

Bitcoin may do alright with 2nd layer solutions like lightning networks, but I still don't think it can do what a DPOS chain can do. Whatever scaling solution they can come up with (sharding, etc), we could probably also implement to even further increase our performance lead.

So yeah. Call me a fanboy if you want, but I'm excited to be invested in STEEM, BitShares, and EOS. I think these DPOS coins represent a future which can truly scale to solve enterprise-level problems.

I'm glad you're with me on this journey here on the STEEM blockchain. As always, this isn't investment advice (blah, blah, blah), but it's just me sharing my passion.

Side note, I left this rediculously long comment to my friend @uberbrady defending DPOS. If you care about this geeky stuff, maybe give it a read. Thinking about all this is what got me fired up enough to write this post. DPOS is an amazing thing.


Luke Stokes is a father, husband, business owner, programmer, STEEM witness, and voluntaryist who wants to help create a world we all want to live in. Visit UnderstandingBlockchainFreedom.com

I'm a Witness! Please vote for @lukestokes.mhth

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Man I totally agree. Steem is not getting the love it deserves. From the last I checked Steem did 1 million transactions per day more than any other blockchain and Bitshares was doing about the same. Ethereum is not getting any love either over 800,000 transactions a day with a large monetary value moving across its chain. uRaiden went live the other day on ETH and no one hardly even noticed. That's Ethereum's lightening network live on its main net now. I'll trade Bitcoin when it crashes down again but I am holding off hodling large amounts like I use to. Projects like EOS, NEO, ETH, DASH, STEEM, SMART CASH will go parabolic in 2018 as people finally realize Bitcoin's limitations. There's other promising cryptos but all the one's I am talking about are at least 2nd generation or 3rd generation projects that are self-evolving extremely fast to serve real world use cases and to meet the user needs above all.

Very well said. I wonder about the onramps most of all. If more exchanges don't pop up with alternate pairs outside of just BTC and if more fiat to cryptocurrency onramps don't support different currencies, it may take a while. I've heard rumors Coinbase may support various altcoins next year. If that happens, things could get really interesting.

I wasn't aware of uRaiden, I'll have to look into that. All I kept hearing about is how the ETH network was getting destroyed by digital kitties.

I've also been thinking about how much the "go green" narrative may hurt adoption for POW coins. I know ETH is planning on making a change at some point to POS, so that might really help them in the long run. I don't own many ETH at the moment. Something else I don't own much of is privacy coins like Monero. I may pick up some more of that as well.

The EU has one of the most interesting crypto debit cards with UQuid, who allow people to pay from their balance in 89 alt coins. I think as more regulation is finalised, and the main card issuers return to the scene, we will soon see those cards and subsequently also apps for direct p2p/b2c transitions.

I doubt we are very far away from more alt-coins adoption. Graphene chains will be very critical in that further propagation of alt coins because of their speed.

I can’t wait until locally I can just send SBD to each mom and pops store. At least all those in my walking range I got to accept mobile payments. With coins.ph. :D

That's very cool. I hope more countries follow along with stuff like that.

I was looking at that card the other day ( I was hoping they did a debit card)

A quick question (you have forgotten more than I will ever know!)

What would you suggest the best way to get my lite coin (or bitcoin if I change it) in to local currency (in thailand?)

(If you are not a us citizen), it seems a little difficult ( from the limited search I have done, before switching off)
Maybe I am being stupid... ( no surprise there).

If you know off the top of your head, ( I do not expect you to research it for me!) -point me in the right direction...?

Cheers

I have no experience there, sorry. Maybe bitspark.io?

no worries mate. cheers

Yes, POS will get a lot of love in 2018 as ETH, EOS, NEO hit. To be far EOS is DPOS and NEO is DBFT but there's no proof of work and massive amounts of energy (gigantic mining farms) involved like Bitcoin. There's also something else called collateralized mining that uses very low energy algo (POW) combined with staking (collateral) that was once on Dash's roadmap, which I believe will eventually happen on Dash's network. Yes, Coinbase is about to add a lot of new fiat pairs. I think this news alone will drive a massive alt rally and it will make the space much more robust as those alts would finally decouple from BTC. ViaBTC just added a Bitcoin Cash only exchange for alts. There's also a few more apps adding fiat exchange. Circle is coming back with fiat alt pairs and another one just cam online called Revolt. 2018 should be one hell of year for crypto but at some point things are going to get so crazy like in 99' it might take a year or so to cool off. I am positive prices of crypto will get way ahead of user adoption but I don't think we are close yet. Crypto could be one of those things that corrects 50% then makes another move higher even if we go into a massive bubble. I guess we'll find out.

Ethereum is not getting any love either over 800,000 transactions a day with a large monetary value moving across its chain.

CryptoKitties crashed ETH network. But next year ETH is moving to POS as well, that should vastly improve its performance.

Oh yeah, people will seriously regret not having ETH b/c it will be required to be a validator. Ethereum has major improvements coming with the largest developer and blockchain based project in the world. POW in and of itself is like the Model-T ford. A revolution at the time but just a decade later much better cars arrived.

I doubt that ETH would go parabolic in 2018. NEO does have a bunch of DAPPs coming up. Smart Cash-I haven't done enough research. Dash, EOS, STEEM would be killing it. I wouldn't be slightly surprised if all 3 of them go up 2500%

Also I have high hopes for NEM and PIVX (Litecoin to Dash)

POS sure but DPOS, I don't see the value in delegates, DASH masternodes and Crown duel nodes are far more effective and efficient then the vote delegate process. an't nobody got time for that nonsesne.

I'm excited to be invested in STEEM, BitShares, and EOS

How dare you? Go from the norm?

You are a visionary that sees ahead... and then has the non-shy attitude of sharing it with others?

You are doing a real service to your followers because you have a fault (like most heros in literature have a fault)...

You insist on talking and sharing about real things... real possibilities.. and real truth in life.

...which is exactly why I follow you, and why I upvote your witness.

You're a diamond in the rough and I love that part of reading your posts.

Thanks @lukestokes --- you're the real deal and I enjoy you sharing a part of you when you write. This is not some nicely sounding comment. I almost feel that people like you and are I dying breed. We need to show the world together that life is not about greed, but giving back and helping others....

Look at this:

Luke Stokes is a father, husband, business owner, programmer, STEEM witness, and voluntaryist who wants to help create a world we all want to live in.

Pleased to know you.

Wow. Thank you so much. I love getting upvotes, for sure, but comments like this really encourage me so much. :)

I too feel the same about comments. I always love a good informative discussion even if it gets really heated up.

Thanks @lukestokes for sharing.
This is exactly the type of info I am aiming to compile while pitching few investors next week for steem.
Been planning to do this for a while now, it just takes some time to reach the proper people. Steem seriously has the potential to boom, and I believe with proper effort, will, and contribution from all of us we can make it happen.
Thanks again!

Wow, that sounds exciting! If you do a post about how it goes, ping me so I can check it out.

I've watched your excitement about STEEM grow for a while, but it was this post which finally pushed me over the edge to sign up and start learning more. Fun times ahead!

Nice to see you here. :)

@lukestokes sorry to start with this, but have you seen how smartcash is at 0.15 cents? It made a 3x in a week or less. The reason I am telling you this is because after I read your 2 posts on Smartcash and then got your crypto calculator is that I bought some Smartcash, and now its starting to pay off + on the 24th we'll stake around a 13% of coins, right?

Now going to Bitshares, and Steem, I would like to add EOS. The 3 are the dream team. Fiat will flow to crypto via Bitcoin and ETH as happening now, the 2 most known, then to LTC and the other top 10. Because of advertising and because are the next most known.

But finally when none of them can't deliver, as @stan mentioned in his latest post, the bigger transfer of wealth that ever happend in history will take place, when money flows to BTS, Steem and EOS. This are the blockchains that can really deliver all the needs and transaction times, as well as bandwith needed to cover all demands.

Crazy times we are living with crypto.

Thanks for sharing all your knowledge and experience to the steemit community.

Upvoted!

Regards, @gold84

Yeah, I'm holding SmartCash, looking forward to those Christmas SmartRewards. :)

It's an amazing time to be alive and be in cryptocurrency, that's for sure.

@lukestokes thanks for the follow up, yes, me too, I am holding Smartcash. Crazy times. When do you think can happen the next dip? When governments start pushing more and more on centralized exchanges?

I have been posting over 20 ideas/posts to improve the steemit interface and make it easier for new members and new visitors to learn about steemit, steem, cryptocurrency, and how they can earn rewards and transform them to other crypto and finally (if they need so), in order to increase the capture and retain of people on the platform, and thus bring more creative and smart people to steemit.

I listened to the entire panel from @aggroed and your feedback was excellent for the meeting and for the steemit community. When you get a chance to go to my blog and comment on some of the ideas it would be great.

Regards, @gold84

Wow, Utopian is really paying out a lot for those link suggestions. :)

Some make sense and some, I think, have to do with an issue with vision and clarity related to what steemit.com is supposed to be. It doesn't focus on anything specific (the exchange, the wallet, the blogging, the communities, etc).

Thanks @lukestokes for your feedback!
Perhaps some of the ideas and links need to be placed inside a tab/link were the most important of this links are shared. Many of them are thinks that could really help new members and visitors get the real idea of steemit and the steem blockchain.

Your thoughts?

Regards, @gold84

STEEM is not getting the love it deserve that true,,,,,it should be at 10$ now,,,,,

$10 sounds good to me. :)

DPOS is an amazing and my top holdings reflect that. Although I sold all my SBD the other day :) One of my biggest influencers is convinced the EOS is a scam though... it's hard defending something to someone that is so knowledgeable, but I see it's value.

EOS is a scam because... why?

I tell those people to go to the github repo, download the code themselves, run it, compile a contract, and then explain to me their "scam" reasoning. Maybe they just don't like people making billions of dollars due to their proven track record?

nice post @lukestokes
i think from the stats, even though btc and ether has so many volume of trade, yet steem has capacity of handling better transactions. does it mean that steem can handle transactions volume even with the crypto kitties? need more explanations on DPOS from my master @lukestokes
thanks sir for all the knowledge so far. upped

Yes, it does. Check the steemit blog post I linked to for more information.

ok will do now thanks and keep it up. do also on your spare time to go through this excellent new token via their website and telegram
https://www.elyte.biz
best regards

@lukestokes I am a Big Fan of your clear and concise BLOGing style and I appreciate your Sober Thoughts on everything Crypto.....

Thank you for saying so. Much appreciated.

I feel like STEEM and BitShares need very big marketing campaigns to make everyone realize this.

Also I was never in the BitShares camp before getting on Steemit mainly because I tried to Mine Protoshares back in 2013 and didn't get anything and I was pissed.

But why do you feel that BitShares didn't become the platform that everyone built on? From my understanding couldn't people build applications and launch / fund projects on BitShares?

Or were the tools never put in place for developers to really have much more than the decentralized exchange?

I agree, and that's why I put this post together. People need to realize this, and we just need to keep repeating it until they do.

As to why BitShares hasn't been taken more seriously and used more to launch new projects, I don't really know. All I can think of is that the timing of the cryptocurrency decline in value in 2014 really hurt them and the "self-funded" projects they were doing at the time. When the funds dried up, things failed, and investors (from one point of view) got shafted. Many took their ball and went home, never to come back.

I'd love to know more of the backstory there as some people are still upset at how things went down.

I keep repeating stuff on my new videos as to how Something like Steemit wouldn't be able to run on Ethereum. Every video is a mini Graphene blockchain commercial. Heheheh

That makes sense if the funding dried up. I think a lot of the people who made it through the nuclear winter have been blown away by how much some of these ICOs have raised when they were working for free and waiting for years to hopefully get some capital appreciation on their coins. It's a long time to wait. Hopefully STEEM can keep making headway and EOS can be everything we imagine. I'm actually buying more on Binance right now. I have 111 EOS stuck in transit from HitBTC.....not a good feeling. I just keep buying though. I'm not likely to hit my target with it but as many as I can get is not enough!

Have you taken a look at Tron? The bloody thing went past Billion and @haejin, a great TA on steemit thinks it'll go much higher. I haven't read their whitepaper. They do have the luxury of picking apart STEEM and learning from it. But would they be able to become real competition at least to the level of EOS vs NEO?

I haven't dug real deep on TRON, I got airdropped some in my HitBTC account and I'm letting it sit there. But I will have to look into it more. I have been buying up EOS like crazy but it ran real hard.

I totally agree with this 100% . Call me a fanboy or whatever but I really believe in the Steem blockchain . It’s transaction fees are Zero and with its 3 Sec. block confirmation times it’s a force to be known and once it becomes known I want to be in a position where I am staking tons of steem as well as EOS and Bitshares. It’s only a matter of time ... and oh yeah I read your comment defending DPOS , it’s some good stuff I agree with a lot of your point of views . Thanks for the great content , keep educating the community!

Thanks for reading! I'm glad you enjoy it. :)

The fact that Ethereum is switching to POS definitely is a proof of the fact that it's a much better system. Maybe after they do this switch the Cryptokitties will start purring again hehe

Meow. Heheh. Yeah, I haven't gotten into all that craziness but I love the idea. I was thinking a while back how cool it would be to do a pokemon go type game on the blockchain.

Pokémon on the blockchain definitely sounds cool. Maybe we will start having kids that become crypto millionaires hehe not impossible these days

with time and effort from all the Steemit community i'm sure Steem will go up, we need to take advantage of being so early in the platform, maybe we need to play the long game, who sows will harvest

I mentioned something in a previous post about the ethereum network being clogged by the kittens as one reason I took my ETH profits in the 400's recently.. That and it keeps getting rejected around $470 and is ...facepalm.

SO I'm stackin STEEM (have been for awhile) and am continuing to load up on BTS (hold about 5k and I want more like 10k) and of course I want a large position in EOS too. At some point people will have a "come to Jesus" moment about transaction speeds and capacity and realize that's where the value will lie in cryptos in a few years.

It's cool though,I like buying BTS between 7 and 17 cents and I loved my EOS buy between 60 cents and $2.50 or whatever my first buy was (something like that). It didn't look so hot at 50 cents but it sure looks good now.

I remember a few weeks ago my account value was a little over $5k and sine then I've only bought a little bit of STEEM but my account value has gone over 10k today due to the rise in STEEM. I knew all those buys between $0.90 and 1.40 would pay off sooner or later.

Onward and upward! Who's excited??

I am! I am!

/me raises his hand

Yeah, I really wish I was buying EOS at $0.50. I had planned to buy more, but I had to wait for my budget to open up a bit. Once it did, it mooned. Oops.

Yes man I agree with you. This is why I'm of steem ans eos, this last will be amazing.

I wrote a post about DPOS telling why it is so fast (in spanish).

Well written Luke!

I am glad I took the time to learn about Bitshares about a month after I joined Steemit. The growth of my crypto holdings has mainly been due to learning how to trade on the Bitshares DEX. Without that, I wouldn't be nearly as far a long as I am.

I'm definitely long on DPOS crypto currencies, too.

There are 21 million bitcoins.

Most of those bitcoins are held by ideological hodlers who won't sell until post-hyperbitcoinization.

There are thousands of Wall Street traders who are all experiencing massive Bitcoin FOMO.

You do the math.

I do think bitcoin will be the king for quite some time, but I also think it has a lot of work to do to stay relevant compared to competitors.

I also believe that

Total agree with you. Great observation and information.

you're not a fanboy, but a diehard so am i

I wasn't aware of uRaiden, I'll have to look into that. All I kept hearing about is how the ETH network was getting destroyed by digital kitties.

I've also been thinking about how much the "go green" narrative may hurt adoption for POW coins. I know ETH is planning on making a change at some point to POS, so that might really help them in the long run. I don't own many ETH at the moment. Something else I don't own much of is privacy coins like Monero. I may pick up some more of that as well.

What the hell? Why are you pasting in my comments as if they are your own?

we need a catchy meme for STEEM
something about Speed and not wanting to slow down after you've experienced it.

Maybe something with fewer stereotypically racist undertones as well. Heheh.

I agree though, a solid meme would be great.

"Pay for transactions? Wait 10 minutes? Are you serious? What is this, 2009?"

it's got to alliterate.
rhyme

Hola amigo, tengo unas pocas monedas de steem guardadas, esperando el alza de las mismas, quiero seguir, no se mucho de trading pero estoy aprendiendo un poco. saludos y gracias por su buen trabajo de información importante. Bendiciones..!

¡Aprender es siempre algo bueno!

Si amigo, el aprendizaje es a diario, saludos a su familia. : )

I am glad to be here grinding with you guys. Maybe it takes its time 👍😉 Time will tell!
I will be enjoying and having fun here while I am waiting patiently for the big bang 🙈😂

you know @lukestokes it really is amazing. especially in times like these with crypto cats and everyone jumping on bitcoin to see the foresight and the blockchain smarts and the ROOM to grow on that super low network usage percentage. .. makes you feel like you backed the right horse ;)

Thanks. I sure hope so. My only second-guessing happens when I think, "Maybe I'll buy other stuff and then come back into this before it moons." I said that about EOS and didn't buy nearly enough when it was sitting at $0.50 for quite some time. Timing is... difficult. Easier just to buy, hold, and wait.

yeah i bought EOS low, it's doing nice. but i'll HODL that for a long while yet! :)

I get what's being said here and agree but because the masses are really only getting exposure through lamestream, their holy grail for knowledge, don't you think that BTC is just going to keep rising as many predict due to more and more coming into the market? Steem and steemit are wonderful and IMO much better just as stated but so few even realize it's existence. Sure later into the ever growing "coming out" of the dark ages of people letting go of the dying fiat system steem and others will flourish but right now, with the mass who seem to be waking up, it's BTC...............

Time will tell, I guess. For many people learning about BTC is a huge mental shift. Going from there to realizing there are over 1,000 other cryptocurrencies, many of which (most, actually) are better technically than bitcoin, well that's another mental hoop to jump through. People will get there, but it might take some time.

I agree and now, just today, Wall Street on board is going to make this IMO VERY interesting indeed.

sooner or later people will realise the actual value of steem.just don't give up...keep steeming

I've yet to power down in the last year and half. :)

You are the one that introduced me to the Bitshares Dex and I've never looked back. I think this will be a great year for both Bitshares and Steem.

Their is lighting bitcoin the new fork of bitcoin that basically steem with the bitcoin name https://news.bitcoin.com/the-first-dpos-hard-fork-lightning-bitcoin-is-on-the-way/

it quite interesting to know that bitcoin can use graphene but will never use it.

I have seen the vast majority will go to the less improved older solution that has been around longer in spite of significant improvements.

It is simple Network Effects. Why aren't we all speaking Esperanto? The invented language that is designed and doesn't have the warts present in pretty much every living language today? Why do we use QWERTY when the DVORAK system keeps the most used letters where the fingers rest while typing? Why the hello do people insist on paying me through banks? For those of us who get the crypto-currency advantage, why is Bitcoin even relevant today?

All of these are about network effects. I am not going to try to expend the energy to teach Esperanto to others before having a conversation when we can both speak the same language already. I can take the keys out of the keyboard and rearrange it for DVORAK but I can touch type using QWERTY. People can send me money for a $10 fee in Bitcoin 5 cent fee in Nubits for free in Steem dollars instead of insisting on paying the swift fees, but then they don't know how to first buy the Bitcoin Nubits Steem dollars.

It's going to take time for people to get into bitshares or perhaps it will just never go over a dollar each. Now we have free transactions on Steem. I am waiting for the value of the Steem dollar to go down to a dollar again.

You always do an awesome job of explaining this stuff. The DPOS, no fees and transaction times are amazing.

I know that most coins seem to have a max count but Steem doesn't. Does this play into the value at all? I guess it had to be this way to continually reward posts.

great article, thanks for sharing! I am fairly new to the scene but objectively see value in DPOS...for whatever reason, on bitcointalk and amongst the crypto scene i see a lot of "scam!" accusations around bitshares, steem, and EOS. What did Dan Larimer do to piss everyone off so much? haha . a disproportionate amount of the crypto world seems to be against that guy

I definitely think we'll be seeing $10 prices next year. I believe we've hit the bottom and steem is on the way up.

I hope so, but I also think most of the market still follows BTC. If it goes down hard, everything gets impacted.

Fantastic post Luke. It's nice to see a great crypto mind like yours confirm thoughts I've been having. EOS has potential for huge growth next year, Steem as well. Especially as the weaknesses of the bigger chains of BTC and ETH show weakness. I find it utterly humorous that ETH is brought to its knees by digital cats. You can't make this stuff up!

Perhaps the slow growth of these great DPOS chains is people on the outside think it's too centralized? I can see where that thought may come from with a relatively small pool of witnesses writing all the blocks. I think the points you make here counteract that though: witnesses aren't competing to mine the newly generated coins and racing each other for the most powerful hardware.

I'm with you in the DPOS chains and bought some LTC about a week ago for the purpose of getting EOS. I'm making the trade today, and thankfully my LTC has doubled in the meantime. Now I'll be ready for EOS to moon next year! :wink:

@lukestokes
Also, a little more on the crypto kitties. Crazy that this took off on a chain that can't handle the number of transactions it generates, and charges transaction fees. So anytime you breed your cat, give someone a cat, etc, that's a transaction requiring a fee. And you'll have to wait for that transaction to be written to a block...
It's hard to not imagine something like this would be much more successful on the Steem blockchain. No wait, no transaction fees. It is amusing how many new users of crypto this resulted in. Leave it to cats to bring more people into the revolution. Haha.

whats the advantage of dpos vs. pos? never understood this

I get you, and indeed 3 seconds block confirmation time is what is required for using a coin for payments; And that is THE case for crypto currencies, at least for mass adoption. Since Steem has NO transaction fee, the coin is also perfect to be used for micro transactions. I get that indeed.

For now, Steem seems to be an outperformer in terms of speed, and technology. But I think the world is not sitting still and competing blockchains will be introduced. Then the main thing will be marketing, something that Steemit INC is not concentrating on IMHO.

Wrt competition, you mentioned Bitcoin and also I don't see Bitcoin will not become a real competitor in that sense. However, what do you think of the claims EOS is making? They build next generation Steem I suppose. And since Steemit INC ex-CTO is with EOS, we can also expect Applications around EOS, maybe even the next generation Steemit?

And don't you thing the other coins that build faster blockchains, also with parallel blockchains, and I suppose matrixes of blockchains, will not be able to come close or at the mark of 3 seconds we have with Steem?

I was always taught POW was the best. You've changed my opinion @lukestokes.

A well written and presented argument.

Wow, thank you. It's not often opinions change on the Internet. You honor me, sir. :)

You're welcome!👍

As a bit of a tree hugger, the other beneficial thing of DPOS block chains is the lower energy required to run the entire system. Large mining servers are not hashing continuously in large warehouses everywhere fighting for the block.
A relatively small server with easily obtainable specs is all that is required.

Darryl (@dadview) resides in Canada. He is an active member of The Alliance and teamcanada
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Yeah, i heard about the uRaiden it went live and it was not getting enough attention, i think people have alot in there hands already.
Many people are trying to build their investment in other crypto they invested in, so it might be difficult for them to give a look in to another opportunity though in the crypto world timing is very inportant, compare to real world evaluation of new business opportunity, in crypto the earlier the better and i will also look at the uRaiden too. Thanks for the enlightenment @lukestockes.