Thoughts about comments in posts
I've been thinking lately, as an avid Redditor who just loved the comment section so much more than the actual content and spent most of his time in r/askreddit which gave you entertainment to no end at one point. Somehow it seems that the comments here on Steem aren't as entertaining, I am not quite sure what it is so I thought I'd just bring this up here and we can have a discussion.
There are a few reasons that come to mind though which I wanna talk about here before we go straight to the "what do you think?".
This being a blockchain and it not being editable, even if it were to be editable there is always proof of your original post/comment saved in the blockchain forever and anyone curious enough could find out what was originally said with the right tools. Is this something that scares people off? As in not saying what is in their mind at the time because of repercussions in the future?
Steem has a way for anyone to stay anonymous, this is also a strength of reddit where you can just anonymously make an account and go from there, say what you want without a care in the world. Here there are consequences though, it's not just like on reddit where if you happen to write something that no one agrees with and or think that was really inappropriate, etc, you can just delete it and no one will find out unless someone quoted you or took a screenshot of it for some reason. Or you can just not care and move on onto the next thread or other subreddit, it's not like people are gonna start following you around making fun of you about something random you said. Here though flags are a lot more easy to detect, someone checks your comments and they can easily spot it. That's not even the biggest issue cause if you write a lot of comments it won't be as easy to notice it if someone happens to look into your account. The other big consequence here is reputation and rewards, not that a few flags on a comment you wish you hadn't written are going to affect your rep score a lot but I mean reputation in general and consequences can be that you will scare a lot of people off or make them not want to reward you anymore in the future.
Is this why people are a lot more careful on Steem about what they comment in other people's posts?
To be honest I've been thinking about this for some time now and sure it may have changed the way I am on the platform as well compared to IRL or on Reddit. Even though I know I am anonymous here and it wouldn't get back to me if I did say my mind about a topic where I am the minority who thinks that way and it wouldn't affect my real life in the way that people would start ignoring me because of my actions on Steem. You are automatically more careful though, is this a good thing? Some times sure, if you're really angry and do something you might regret later, the thought in the back of your head reminding you that this is a blockchain can sometimes save you from those moments but is this also something that is keeping people from writing more entertaining and engaging comments?
I don't know, maybe its just that the userbase is still so small and everyone is still trying to make a lot of rewards by being an author or something else involved in other apps that they barely have the time or care to write comments. Engagement levels are pretty low and it seems like most of the time its accounts who already know eachother quite well that interact more in the comment section. Maybe I'm just comparing it to a 100x bigger platform too much. I don't know.
I've also been thinking about rewarding yourself with a vote on comments more often. This has been something I have been against for the last two years now cause it just feels wrong in many ways, such as forcefully voting your own comment to the top of the authors post instead of receiving a vote from the author of other readers instead. Is this making me unconsciously comment less? Maybe this part of the discussion is meant for another post, I'm sidetracking.
Anyway, what do you think about comment engagement on the platform and do you think it being a blockchain is making people too careful about what they write?
Would it be different if it wasn't on a blockchain?
I'm not 100% sure where I was going with this post or if it makes any sense, so if you feel that way as well having read this then let me know. Maybe its just the bottom of the bear market and the low activity making me think this way. There are a lot of long and thoughtful discussions going on on the blockchain and plenty of comments to reward. I remember way back almost no one would spend voting power in the comment section so I'm glad things have changed but it just doesn't feel as fun yet some how.
To be honest, when I first joined, comments were everything... everyone seemed really engaged and positive, and I made so much more with my comments than I ever could with my posts... I would randomly get really big upvotes on comments that weren't even my best comments, just some random whale agreed with me...
People weren't just getting comments, but entire conversations were unraveling that were even more interesting than the posts themselves. Personally, I feel that all disappeared once people started investing their SP in Smartsteem, MinnowBooster, Bitbots and Dapps for tokens… along with autovoting for curation rewards. In my eyes voting has slid from engaging and rewarding to an investment...
Honestly, it feels like people barely read the comments of their posts let alone upvote people for the time they've spent on those comments... they're too busy pumping out content for their autovotes.
Interesting point @aussieninja
This is a two sided problem:
ROI is the dumbest thing to look for on a social media platform. It's the number of genuine people you have in your network who are willing to engage and spread your content that matters. Look at which accounts have the most value in YouTube or Twitter. It's all about influence. To be honest, if the whales are busy selling votes, it makes it much easier for smaller accounts to pick up followers, so I am not complaining. When this platform grows, we shall see if I am right.
Vote buyers are shooting themselves in the foot. They are essentially paying for votes that are due to them and rewarding users who have no interest in their content. Again, I may be wrong, but it will be interesting to see how this plays out.
I am not saying these tools have no place here on the platform, but i do think it's gone a bit too far.
@kabir88
This is sad but true, combine it with the bear market and not many are around to give a shit about posts let alone comments.
I hate when I see that, authors posting their regular shit, getting autovotes, bid bots or votetrades and not coming back til their next post. It's so disrespectful to ignore your comments especially on a unique platform that lets you reward your readers for their time. Pff.
Yeah, I totally agree.... I can't help but think those people that haven't bothered to engage or reply will be totally lost when their autovoters move onto whatever more-profitable tasty businesses rock up with SMTs... while those loved by their readers will still have friends to play with.
That honestly never occurred to me... but you're right, I can't think of any other platform that rewards a person's readers... apart from a worthless visual tick, thumbs up, etc.
Not only that but as you said people I think are commenting and engaging less as they are busy with pumping out their own content. Sad really. I am lucky to get a handful of genuine comments from real people
Agree with this. Most of us are here for money, and vote selling made it easy.
Posted using Partiko Android
exactly! and in fact, perhaps all are actually here for money - just some are more HYIP-minded (and thus employ whatever means possible and available as bots, etc) and others are less. thus it makes people "Content Indifferent", as some rightly call it.
so, regarding the main questions asked in this post:
what I think is, most (or rather all) people are first of all focused on earning, Content is secondary in best case. then a lot (or majority?) of people focused only on making money - thus Content is not even in their attention / focus at all: why bother, if it is not necessary condition to be able to earn more, but rather actually distracts and takes away time which can be used to earn more? :D
(or do some other things, like "offline" / in real life - and leave the "curation" etc. to bots)
especially since System is made in such a way that it kind of "encourages" that (if not almost forces)
so, it doesn't actually matter: whether it is on blockchain or .... on some similar HYIP-like based platform where people mainly focused on money making.
and I doubt it very much or perhaps even rather sure that most do not worry or fear of anything - they simply don't give a damn. LOL
So, that's my brief answer to these questions: "business model" or "ecosystem" is made in such a way that it attracts people with HYIP mentality and / or enthuses them to be more minded so.
(here is in a bit more details)
Facts! too much emphasis on rewards now.
I think that comment engagement is low not because its blockchain itself. People just want to earn rewards as author. Same on vimm, everyone wants to stream (because they want to earn rewards) . Its sad that people are selfish.
Also I need to agree with that quote. I feel the same on my posts/streams mostly people that knows me comming to comment/talk.
I would say that upvoting comments is a good way to motivate people but its still not what we want. We want people to be more active on content that they enjoy not because they can earn some $.
I think a good way to motivate people to comment is to made a question like u did.
Lets just hope that people will stop being selfish. We should encourage people to comment and be active on blockchain. If we want to create a better place for authors we need active readers too.
He's a fan of sub ask reddit that's why LOLOL
Hey! What happens on smoke stays on smoke! No crosschain gossip!
<3
reddityo lol 😂
Love that LOLOL
Yes we want people here to engage for the fun of it without rewards being the number one factor - I generally engage with the same people alot on here -maybe I should expand out a little bit
@acidyo, you ask a great question! I think there are a number of factors involved in my view and you've touched on a few already. I can only speak for myself and what I have found to work in terms of getting engagement.
Many authors do not create posts that are designed for engagement, some are just posting information or opinions with no real call for responses. If someone is already so resolute in their view, why waste time engaging with them?
Perceived value. There is still a feeling that the most earnings can be had from authoring a post rather than taking time to make meaningful comments. For example, if I wrote this comment as a post, the payout would most likely be higher. But I would much rather be part of a conversation, so am willing to take time to make meaningful comments
Consequences. It seems expressing a minority opinion is not the done thing. Whether that's done via comments or downvotes, the risk of reprisals are high.
Finally. On the bright side. The stats from this post show some positive movement towards a community that's engaging in conversation rather than everyone trying to be the next Shakespeare
https://busy.org/@penguinpablo/daily-steem-stats-report-wednesday-october-24-2018
This graph from the post shows it best:
Authors who make effort to reward engagement via a vote or atleast a response tend to have much higher level of comments.
@kabir88
Well said.
Also what happened to your rep?
Long story man! I am not a fan of self voting, specially when I saw someone do it 10 times a day on repetitive posts.. so I flagged them. Then there was a truce, but the same account started self voting their comments to above $80+, so flagged them again... You can guess the rest of the story and who that might have been ;)
You're a braver man than I kabir. Let's get you back up to the rep score you should have.
I'll try to remember to check your comments every day,
:( that sucks, and yeah I can very well guess who. Oh well Bernie made it out from -18? So you'll get there some day. Here's a little push.
Thanks @acidyo! That means a lot and not just the monetary value. It's reassuring to know there is still a good amount of STEEM power in the hands of people who genuinely care about the growth of this platform and the new users that land on our shores with dreams and aspirations
I can vouch for @kabir88 - a great community minded Steemian - thanks for running the #upvoteplankton initiative!
I remember following along when you got flagged to the ground - im glad you just keep on Steeming - im sure you will reach a positive Rep again soon enough :)
Thanks @conradt! Appreciate it.
I remember learning in my Maths Mechanics class the basic formula for Power.
Power = work done/time
Work done = force x distance
So, if we apply a small force over a long period of time, the results can be surprisingly large!
Sure. Bernie should be role model for all the people who got flagged to death.
Posted using Partiko Android
Ahh...but how many of those comments are due to one author getting 15 bot comments per post? ;)
The short answer is: the post makes 100% sense but you focus too much on the lesser issues.
The long answer:
Sorry for the long comment, I hope you get to see it. Cheers !
I do read 99% of the comments on my posts actually. I may not always vote them up or respond to them but I do always read them. :) Sometimes I just filter them by age instead especially if I have to upvote them cause that makes it not jump after each vote which is very annoying.
That's good to know, I thought there were simply too many comments to go through :)
Interesting. My guess would be the repercussions of getting flagged. Here you are accountable for your comments and they last forever on the blockchain. But maybe it can also be the fact we are a smaller niche community and it is like a small town where everyone knows everyone kinda. As Steem gets bigger maybe people will loosen up because it won’t echo so loudly if they make a very controversial comment.
Posted using Partiko iOS
I agree when it comes to flagging --I try not to flag just because I dont like the arguments or a point of view, for example, I would say flagging should be just used when someone is rude, racist, hate speech or heavily spam the blockchain or abuse the reward pool. there are not that many users and it feels like when you press the downvote button its a personal insult and mostly it ends with a counter flag for no reason. there is a lot of crap content on steem which I would like get rid off but If big players or even witnesses dont care than small accounts will usually just stay still, get some reward and leave steem.
Perhaps it would be beneficial for someone to build a UI that cares less about the (non-consensus) rep score, or replaces it entirely. This may be an issue with steemit.com rather than Steem.
I don't regularly comment here because there isn't usually many comments that I want to respond to. On reddit I might read through 100+ comments before I find one I respond to.
On here I generally just like to read the article.
Gotta admit I feel the same way lately, not sure why. Too many posts too little time? Maybe I'm following too many people.
@acidyo I think for me after reading a post I usually respond based on what I feel as regards the post even without reading other peoples comments. I think this makes my responds be uninfluenced by other peoples comment. Yes I do read other peoples after mine goes out.
I think because I understand how blockchain works I self regulate myself, I think others do too.
Finally, a lot of post on steemit are not so much that engaging, so people don't comment so much. But if post are engaging, with an attractive topic that pulls people to go read it. I find those post usually getting more comments.
That is my 0.02 steem worth of thought on that. Lol
Posted using Partiko Android
I think it is much simpler than that.
This is blogging, with incentives.
Reddit already had awesome comment sections, beating the comments on Digg by lightyears, even before .self and AMA became popular. But the latter definitely helped. Imgur also has organically grown an awesome comment community.
The main focus/use of both platforms is just different. That not necessarily helped by the design either. This here is so... slashdot.
Generally, it isn’t necessarily a good idea to compare. Just check Medium... top quality content and often has only few and regularly crap comments. That bad they even felt the need to create a highlight section.
I've noticed that the few that will upvote your post tend to leave the comment section blank, which could be a good or not so good thing, it all depends on how you look at it.
Unless they truly conversate back and forth with you, then thays always a good thing, then maybe like me sometimes, we just don't know what to say.
You take a chance of getting flagged if uou don't say enough, they say you're spammer, so I guest us minnows are just being very careful right now. But I do agree with your post about the lack of comments.
Yeah unfortunately we've had a wave of spammy comments that now it feels wrong to just comment "hey man, this was a really nice post."