I'll take one point at a time. @intelliguy's response was
One suggestion: minnows was an early term, that is now taboo
According to WHO?
I'm a Texan. One problem we have is that Yankee's leave the hell-hole they created, come to Texas, then immediately starting whining and complaining cause that's not the way we done it where I came from
The typical Texas response is Greyhound is ready when you are
I check his wallet...he's got about eleven hundred steempower.
That tell me that he's a minnow. He hasn't been here very long and he's wanting to change things to suit him. TOUGH SHIT.
If he doesn't like the way we do things here he can leave.
FaceBook is just waiting for him.
I reckon I'm the one 'whining' here =p. I don't find Fakebook acceptable - at all - cuz censorship. I'm not agin' wealth, but as you know from all my prior whinging, I do think Steemit can keep new accounts it attracts at a much better rate by improving VP decay rates for krill (I still don't reckon I qualify as a minnow), and I openly advocate for weighting VP either by rep, or not at all.
The regulations of the SEC, as far as I understand them (IANAL) regard Steem as a security, since it represents voting shares that determine how rewards are disbursed. This could be bad for Steemit, and very bad for the initial miners that created the majority of the Steem extant. Worse for Steemit is that witness votes are also weighted by SP, and this means that just by buying Steem, a Sybil attack can take control over the witnesses, either getting them to run the code preferred by the attacker, or simply voting in new ones that will. At the same time, this would greatly enrich the present holders of Steem.
These aren't problems that will just go away, so I address them as best I am able. I don't want those things to happen to Steemit, nor do I want more than 40% of new accounts to be 'churned', and abandoned, as they are now. This is more than 10 times the churn Fakebook suffers, for example.
@intelliguy seems to have been here a while, while I am the new guy. Just trying to point your anger at the appropriate target, my friend =)
And, I agree with you about the term minnow. I do not like trying to control what we think by controlling the language we can use, and calling a term 'taboo' is a soft form of censorship, IMHO. Orwell treated language at length in "1984" and similar means were described as 'Newspeak'. I know you are not unfamiliar with Orwell, as you regularly quote from it.
Thanks for being quite clear as to your thinking. I appreciate it very much!
That's the sound of an obscure reference going over my head. I remember greenstamps. I fail to make the link to my present predicament. I am clearly a dullard. Sorry!
I'm following you out of respect for what you did, and believe me it is NOT a way of asking you do the same for me :D
I took the risk and put money in here (hoping the price of #steem go up so i can at least recover what i paid coinbase (malocchio) to be able to transfer funds here
Because not only i try and want to believe in the basic principle of steemit. I want also to encourage others (mainly from my country to follow suit).
But what i really wanted to say is that now i also have the slider, someone made me think:
Value Quality over quantity
And thus I've decided i dont touch the slider, my vote at full power might not be worth more than a few cents, (6 actually) and that's pretty cheap to compensate for a full post.
I don't know how to call the whales to chip in with their 1% VP giving away 100$ so i do vote more than 10 times a day (not much more) I try to keep my votes spread over 2 hours period, but whoever gets my vote, gets it at full power and receives my meager 6 cents.
I know what you mean but I upvote comments quite often so slider is useful. The majority of my votes for posts are at 100% but sometimes lower for a funny picture or something. My vote is worth bugger all like yours but hopefully the price of STEEM will go up, and maybe, just maybe, I might stop being lazy & start writing decent posts to increase my SP.
I've upvoted this comment at 100% & I will follow you back. Venezuela is somewhere I've always wanted to visit but never made it. Hopefully I will make it before the US take over ;-)
I want to believe we will join a group of committed Venezuelans working hard into freeing the country by ourselves by raising awareness on the power of the people.
I don't know if the US will take it over, but we expect to drive our country back to its former grandeur.,
Little known fact the Emiraties came in the 70's to ask us how to develop a country based on Oil revenue, we explained to them and somewhere along the path our society lost its way and corruption took over.
See were they are today and were the faux-left took us on populist promises... the richest country in south america begging for food and medical supplies. And the fat commies with even fatter swiss bank accounts draining the richness that belongs to 33 million people.
I hope to one day soon to be able to tell you; please by all means go and visit!
You will be safe and enjoy!
Imma hafta get used to the slider now. I was surprised when it showed up. LOL, I thought it was some kinda mistake at first, until I looked on Steemd and saw you went ahead and did it anyway =)
You are clearly the kinda guy that a) doesn't take no for an answer, and b) puts his money where his mouth is. I reckon both are admirable qualities, and prolly why I followed you to begin with.
I'll practice tomorrow =D
Edit: and thanks for the @randowhale boost! Never had one before.
No problem. I was hoping you were going to be ok about it. I joined Steemit just over a year ago and happened to post something that made $50 in rewards on my first post. I stopped using Steemit for a couple of months after this but when I signed back in I found I had 350SP due to the value of Steem increasing so much between when I posted and when the reward was paid (I think). So I had a good head start but I had the same problem as you with the voting because I hadn't yet reached 500SP. I invested about £150 into Steem to take me over 500SP and everything since then has been made from posting and curating. My point is that I basically got around 300SP for nothing so delegating 100SP to allow a great contributor to Steem to be able to increase his influence is nothing really. The SP is still mine anyway so everyone wins !!
When you get to 500SP without delegation from me I will probably take it back but until then I hope it helps.
Take it easy.
I'm not sure if you can return delegated SP. I'll look into it. I do know that it takes 7 days from the day the remove delegation command is issued for it to actually be removed though. If there isn't a way for you to return it & you wanted to you can reply to this or if you wanted the request to be less visible you could send me a memo with a message as part of a small transfer of SBD (0.001).
IIRC there is a 7 day period of unavailability when the delegation is ended (from a post I dimly recall reading not so long ago).
I'm quite pleased to be able to vote (at low %) while allowing my VP to recharge! I am very grateful to you for the confidence and assistance =)
When my own SP is adequate to provide the slider I intend to let you know that the delegation has served it's purpose, so that it can be withdrawn at your convenience.
That is very kind and thoughtful of you! However, I used my own experience as an example of the problem faced by the majority of accounts. I am not personally focused on rewards, but seek the far more rewarding wealth of the ideas of those I follow, like yourself. The problem isn't that I am limited to ~10 votes/day, but that most accounts are, and this strongly demotivates folks from sticking around.
Were it not for the initial delegation of SP, I reckon Steemit would never have grown at all, so while your kindness to me would help me immensely in my ability to interact on Steemit, it would not help all those we need to be retained to make Steemit grow.
Since bots are the issue that were being addressed by making the VP decay rate limit new accounts (for people without enough money to simply buy the SP) to ~10 votes/day, and this decay rate still lets bots cast unlimited votes that impart rewards, I advocate @liberosist's proposed VP decay rate that I outlined above, which does prevent a bot from voting more than a human can.
So, I am not railing against the problem because it impacts me personally, but because it is impacting Steemit, and all of us.
Thank you for voicing your points. As a newbie to this platform, it took me a while to understand the whole voting thing - actually, I am still not 100% sure that I do.
It seems the person is only here to make money. Too bad for him. Most creatives are happy if their work is seen - and money is a greatly appreciated bonus.
Actually, he seems disappointed and a bit mystified as to why his efforts haven't been as rewarded as some, but takes exactly the attitude you recommend. I do find his OP to which I responded quite good for exactly that reason, as I see you also do.
Great minds think alike!
I just wish he'd schooled me at the point he decided I was just gonna ignore any good points he made. That's why I made this post: in the hope that someone will =)
I hate being wrong, so try hard to be right. When someone proves I am wrong, I couldn't be happier, because I then get to change my mind, and get right!
What you say is true. However, I seek to use my SP in order to provide the greatest benefit to the community I can. It's actually a tossup between voting more, and voting harder. I try to vote harder, to grant the greatest reward I can. It may not actually be the right way to go. I dunno.
But I reckon that most folks want that.
Regardless, I used to vote freely what I wanted to upvote, and when I was voting 100+ times per day, my VP became vanishingly small. Took a week to get up to full power =/
That became a sort of training period for me, exercising my willpower to not vote when I wanted to. I guess we form habits thereby.
The app eSteem has a voting slider even if you are under 500 SP so you can vote with 20% or something like that ;)
It's all a matter of preference in the end and it should be unlocked by default and it should have a dedicated page that explains EXACTLY how voting works with examples and predictions on their voting power so as to spread clarity and not this confusion that is increasingly embarrassing.
Coding this into the front end to give people options over how much voting power to spend on a singular vote, so that if they wish they could spend all their power on one vote and do this once every 5 days, or whatever they wish per vote would be a god send and shouldn't take more than 30 fucking minutes. @ned@sneak@dantheman (lololz) and @andarchy.
You are absolutely correct, however, my location makes cell phones a hit and miss affair. I sometimes don't get texts until the next day, and constantly miss calls, because the coverage is so poor, so I haven't even used eSteem.
I have the slider now, so it's moot for me personally, however, the issue still affects ~98% of accounts, so it remains of vital import for all of us, as it dramatically affects retention of new accounts. The dearth of votes available to them is so discouraging I am amazed anyone persists after more than a day or so, after the initial orgy of greetings from their introductory posts.
It works because in spite of that people can publish content and comment and nobody can delete or remove what's published and the bonus is that you can make money. As others have mentioned the voting power is never fully depleted and new users basically vote for purely gestural reasons anyway since their 100% votes don't amount to a cent, if we give people the option to show the payout in Steem that would change, especially if we put it as default to show Steem and not $, all the way to three decimal places. Since voting with less than 100% simply spreads the rewards out more evenly if you vote more than 10 times a day it won't change the fact that if you don't have a bit of SP your vote won't register as anything other than purely a gesture, but I do think more options on a page that is dedicated to explaining how voting/curating works is needed.
"...I do think more options on a page that is dedicated to explaining how voting/curating works is needed."
This is sure true. I think some illustrations would help people envision how it works also. All the various influences on rewards really should be better, and authoritatively, explained, and not only for new users. I am sure that I yet misunderstand, or incompletely comprehend, such intricacies.
"...show Steem and not $, all the way to three decimal places."
And, you have been the recipient of my very first vote with the slider! Hopefully, I can get my VP back up soon, and still be able to vote in the meantime. It's gonna take a few days, I think. It's below 70% atm...
I'll take one point at a time.
@intelliguy's response was
One suggestion: minnows was an early term, that is now taboo
According to WHO?
I'm a Texan. One problem we have is that Yankee's leave the hell-hole they created, come to Texas, then immediately starting whining and complaining cause that's not the way we done it where I came from
The typical Texas response is Greyhound is ready when you are
I check his wallet...he's got about eleven hundred steempower.
That tell me that he's a minnow. He hasn't been here very long and he's wanting to change things to suit him. TOUGH SHIT.
If he doesn't like the way we do things here he can leave.
FaceBook is just waiting for him.
(pisses me off).
LOL
I reckon I'm the one 'whining' here =p. I don't find Fakebook acceptable - at all - cuz censorship. I'm not agin' wealth, but as you know from all my prior whinging, I do think Steemit can keep new accounts it attracts at a much better rate by improving VP decay rates for krill (I still don't reckon I qualify as a minnow), and I openly advocate for weighting VP either by rep, or not at all.
The regulations of the SEC, as far as I understand them (IANAL) regard Steem as a security, since it represents voting shares that determine how rewards are disbursed. This could be bad for Steemit, and very bad for the initial miners that created the majority of the Steem extant. Worse for Steemit is that witness votes are also weighted by SP, and this means that just by buying Steem, a Sybil attack can take control over the witnesses, either getting them to run the code preferred by the attacker, or simply voting in new ones that will. At the same time, this would greatly enrich the present holders of Steem.
These aren't problems that will just go away, so I address them as best I am able. I don't want those things to happen to Steemit, nor do I want more than 40% of new accounts to be 'churned', and abandoned, as they are now. This is more than 10 times the churn Fakebook suffers, for example.
@intelliguy seems to have been here a while, while I am the new guy. Just trying to point your anger at the appropriate target, my friend =)
And, I agree with you about the term minnow. I do not like trying to control what we think by controlling the language we can use, and calling a term 'taboo' is a soft form of censorship, IMHO. Orwell treated language at length in "1984" and similar means were described as 'Newspeak'. I know you are not unfamiliar with Orwell, as you regularly quote from it.
Thanks for being quite clear as to your thinking. I appreciate it very much!
'taboo' is a soft form of censorship
That is all that I have addressed at this point.
Note: consider greenstamps.,
Whoosh!
That's the sound of an obscure reference going over my head. I remember greenstamps. I fail to make the link to my present predicament. I am clearly a dullard. Sorry!
I'm happy to delegate 100SP to put you over 500SP so you will get the voting slider if it would help.
I'm following you out of respect for what you did, and believe me it is NOT a way of asking you do the same for me :D
I took the risk and put money in here (hoping the price of #steem go up so i can at least recover what i paid coinbase (malocchio) to be able to transfer funds here
Because not only i try and want to believe in the basic principle of steemit. I want also to encourage others (mainly from my country to follow suit).
But what i really wanted to say is that now i also have the slider, someone made me think:
Value Quality over quantity
And thus I've decided i dont touch the slider, my vote at full power might not be worth more than a few cents, (6 actually) and that's pretty cheap to compensate for a full post.
I don't know how to call the whales to chip in with their 1% VP giving away 100$ so i do vote more than 10 times a day (not much more) I try to keep my votes spread over 2 hours period, but whoever gets my vote, gets it at full power and receives my meager 6 cents.
I know what you mean but I upvote comments quite often so slider is useful. The majority of my votes for posts are at 100% but sometimes lower for a funny picture or something. My vote is worth bugger all like yours but hopefully the price of STEEM will go up, and maybe, just maybe, I might stop being lazy & start writing decent posts to increase my SP.
I've upvoted this comment at 100% & I will follow you back. Venezuela is somewhere I've always wanted to visit but never made it. Hopefully I will make it before the US take over ;-)
Take it easy.
Thanks for your reply and up-vote Jim!
I want to believe we will join a group of committed Venezuelans working hard into freeing the country by ourselves by raising awareness on the power of the people.
I don't know if the US will take it over, but we expect to drive our country back to its former grandeur.,
Little known fact the Emiraties came in the 70's to ask us how to develop a country based on Oil revenue, we explained to them and somewhere along the path our society lost its way and corruption took over.
See were they are today and were the faux-left took us on populist promises... the richest country in south america begging for food and medical supplies. And the fat commies with even fatter swiss bank accounts draining the richness that belongs to 33 million people.
I hope to one day soon to be able to tell you; please by all means go and visit!
You will be safe and enjoy!
Wow. Well, I dunno what to say. Thanks!
I suppose that's a start =p
Imma hafta get used to the slider now. I was surprised when it showed up. LOL, I thought it was some kinda mistake at first, until I looked on Steemd and saw you went ahead and did it anyway =)
You are clearly the kinda guy that a) doesn't take no for an answer, and b) puts his money where his mouth is. I reckon both are admirable qualities, and prolly why I followed you to begin with.
I'll practice tomorrow =D
Edit: and thanks for the @randowhale boost! Never had one before.
No problem. I was hoping you were going to be ok about it. I joined Steemit just over a year ago and happened to post something that made $50 in rewards on my first post. I stopped using Steemit for a couple of months after this but when I signed back in I found I had 350SP due to the value of Steem increasing so much between when I posted and when the reward was paid (I think). So I had a good head start but I had the same problem as you with the voting because I hadn't yet reached 500SP. I invested about £150 into Steem to take me over 500SP and everything since then has been made from posting and curating. My point is that I basically got around 300SP for nothing so delegating 100SP to allow a great contributor to Steem to be able to increase his influence is nothing really. The SP is still mine anyway so everyone wins !!
When you get to 500SP without delegation from me I will probably take it back but until then I hope it helps.
Take it easy.
Well, I appreciate your thoughtful consideration, and commitment to the platform, as well as your characterization of my own.
Out of curiosity, as I've never paid the matter any mind before, is there a way to return to you the delegation?
I'm not sure if you can return delegated SP. I'll look into it. I do know that it takes 7 days from the day the remove delegation command is issued for it to actually be removed though. If there isn't a way for you to return it & you wanted to you can reply to this or if you wanted the request to be less visible you could send me a memo with a message as part of a small transfer of SBD (0.001).
IIRC there is a 7 day period of unavailability when the delegation is ended (from a post I dimly recall reading not so long ago).
I'm quite pleased to be able to vote (at low %) while allowing my VP to recharge! I am very grateful to you for the confidence and assistance =)
When my own SP is adequate to provide the slider I intend to let you know that the delegation has served it's purpose, so that it can be withdrawn at your convenience.
Thanks!
That is very kind and thoughtful of you! However, I used my own experience as an example of the problem faced by the majority of accounts. I am not personally focused on rewards, but seek the far more rewarding wealth of the ideas of those I follow, like yourself. The problem isn't that I am limited to ~10 votes/day, but that most accounts are, and this strongly demotivates folks from sticking around.
Were it not for the initial delegation of SP, I reckon Steemit would never have grown at all, so while your kindness to me would help me immensely in my ability to interact on Steemit, it would not help all those we need to be retained to make Steemit grow.
Since bots are the issue that were being addressed by making the VP decay rate limit new accounts (for people without enough money to simply buy the SP) to ~10 votes/day, and this decay rate still lets bots cast unlimited votes that impart rewards, I advocate @liberosist's proposed VP decay rate that I outlined above, which does prevent a bot from voting more than a human can.
So, I am not railing against the problem because it impacts me personally, but because it is impacting Steemit, and all of us.
Thank you for voicing your points. As a newbie to this platform, it took me a while to understand the whole voting thing - actually, I am still not 100% sure that I do.
It seems the person is only here to make money. Too bad for him. Most creatives are happy if their work is seen - and money is a greatly appreciated bonus.
Actually, he seems disappointed and a bit mystified as to why his efforts haven't been as rewarded as some, but takes exactly the attitude you recommend. I do find his OP to which I responded quite good for exactly that reason, as I see you also do.
Great minds think alike!
I just wish he'd schooled me at the point he decided I was just gonna ignore any good points he made. That's why I made this post: in the hope that someone will =)
I hate being wrong, so try hard to be right. When someone proves I am wrong, I couldn't be happier, because I then get to change my mind, and get right!
Thanks!
The thing is, I sometimes vote 40 times a day....
The lower your voting power gets, the less your vote is worth... so, actually you can vote pretty much as much as you want...
I haven't run out yet, and I just vote whatever I want.
What you say is true. However, I seek to use my SP in order to provide the greatest benefit to the community I can. It's actually a tossup between voting more, and voting harder. I try to vote harder, to grant the greatest reward I can. It may not actually be the right way to go. I dunno.
But I reckon that most folks want that.
Regardless, I used to vote freely what I wanted to upvote, and when I was voting 100+ times per day, my VP became vanishingly small. Took a week to get up to full power =/
That became a sort of training period for me, exercising my willpower to not vote when I wanted to. I guess we form habits thereby.
The app eSteem has a voting slider even if you are under 500 SP so you can vote with 20% or something like that ;)
It's all a matter of preference in the end and it should be unlocked by default and it should have a dedicated page that explains EXACTLY how voting works with examples and predictions on their voting power so as to spread clarity and not this confusion that is increasingly embarrassing.
Coding this into the front end to give people options over how much voting power to spend on a singular vote, so that if they wish they could spend all their power on one vote and do this once every 5 days, or whatever they wish per vote would be a god send and shouldn't take more than 30 fucking minutes. @ned @sneak @dantheman (lololz) and @andarchy.
You are absolutely correct, however, my location makes cell phones a hit and miss affair. I sometimes don't get texts until the next day, and constantly miss calls, because the coverage is so poor, so I haven't even used eSteem.
I have the slider now, so it's moot for me personally, however, the issue still affects ~98% of accounts, so it remains of vital import for all of us, as it dramatically affects retention of new accounts. The dearth of votes available to them is so discouraging I am amazed anyone persists after more than a day or so, after the initial orgy of greetings from their introductory posts.
It works because in spite of that people can publish content and comment and nobody can delete or remove what's published and the bonus is that you can make money. As others have mentioned the voting power is never fully depleted and new users basically vote for purely gestural reasons anyway since their 100% votes don't amount to a cent, if we give people the option to show the payout in Steem that would change, especially if we put it as default to show Steem and not $, all the way to three decimal places. Since voting with less than 100% simply spreads the rewards out more evenly if you vote more than 10 times a day it won't change the fact that if you don't have a bit of SP your vote won't register as anything other than purely a gesture, but I do think more options on a page that is dedicated to explaining how voting/curating works is needed.
This is sure true. I think some illustrations would help people envision how it works also. All the various influences on rewards really should be better, and authoritatively, explained, and not only for new users. I am sure that I yet misunderstand, or incompletely comprehend, such intricacies.
Great idea, too!
Well, for me, my full power could be worth 15c idk. I'd rather spread the votes. Only real solution is more steem power, methinks (edited)
I'm not exactly sure what you mean, sorry.
And, you have been the recipient of my very first vote with the slider! Hopefully, I can get my VP back up soon, and still be able to vote in the meantime. It's gonna take a few days, I think. It's below 70% atm...
Dang auto correct