Steem Witness Forum: @jesta, @good-karma, @roelandp, @aggroed, @anyx, @ausbitbank, @lukestokes, @someguy123, @followbtcnews

in steem •  2 years ago  (edited)

This Saturday at 11am EST (1600 UTC) I'll be hosting a Steem witness forum. This is a chance for top 20 witnesses on the platform to share what's important to them.

Which witness will be on?

@jesta (chainbb, steemdb, vessel)
@good-karma (esteem)
@roelandp (Steemfest)
@aggroed (Minnow Support Project)
@anyx (Steem Cleaners)
@ausbitbank (Minnow Support Project)
@lukestokes (Exchange Transfer Report)
@someguy123 (Privex)

and similar to the Steem block chain I'm introducing a rotating backup witness into the lineup. This panel discussion will also feature backup witness @followbtcnews (@followbtcnews co-runs his witness with @crimsonclad).

Format

There isn't a ton of structure to being a witness or working as a team of witnesses. By hosting these I'm trying to give witnesses a chance to air thoughts on the current state of steem, projects folks are working on, platform needs, and what the future holds for us all. To help inform one another of what we're all working on I'm inviting other top 20 witnesses to come on a panel and just share their thoughts. I'll provide Steem related question prompts to the panel and they'll get time to answer questions as they see fit or the spirit strikes them.

Logistics

Show starts at 11am this Saturday January 20th.

To join it please hop into the Peace, Abundance, and Liberty Network Discord server home to the Minnow Support Project

Once there say hi and make some friends there's often over 1,000 Steemians online and the server has over 8000 Steemians.

To listen to the show or go to mspwaves.com/listen.
To text to the panel during the show.
To go on air

If you're planning on speaking on air please show up a 10-15 min early and mic check in "MSP Waves Waiting Room." You'll need a headset and a mic.

If you have some burning questions you'd like to ask the witnesses please add them in the comments

Authors get paid when people like you upvote their post.
If you enjoyed what you read here, create your account today and start earning FREE STEEM!
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It is great that you have all these high level witnesses coming together, when great minds collaborate a lot can happen. With that being said, there is a lot that needs to happen in order to secure the long term sustainability of the platform.

One thing I really want to see addressed is the reward pool abuse issue. There are lots of users who currently take advantage of it, and the numbers are only going to continue to grow until something is done. You have people like @haejin posting 9 times a day and taking several thousand dollars out of the reward pool. You have guys like @berniesanders attempting to address it, but his demeanor and ways of going about it are futile. We really need a solution for this, as no one user should be able to siphon this much out of the reward pool daily.

One potential solution was brought up by @ura-soul in his post about Generosity ranking. This is just one idea, but it is a good starting point on how we can address this issue.

When new users, or even long term minnows see how easily some people drain the rewards while they cannot get any visibility it is disheartening and slows the growth of the platform, one of the biggest obstacles we face going forward.

upvoted for visibility.

There's a number of good options that would help to address the issues with reward pool inequalities:

  • Diminishing returns on repeat votes for the same user - EG your first upvote on a user is worth 100% of its regular value, the next upvote is 75%, and so on, with a slow recovery over time similar to how voting power works.
  • Diminishing returns on multiple posts per day - EG your first post in a day is worth 100% of the regular rewards, your second post in a day is worth 75% and so on. This discourages spam posting and encourages more high quality well-thought-out posts.

Both of the above could lead to other problems, such as people creating multiple accounts in order to get around the limitiations... But it's a decent starting point.

Other ideas?

  • Penalize bot usage somehow. A big part of the problem is the fact that many large votes are handed out via automated voting by bots rather than users actually curating and voting on worthwhile content.
  • Re-think post curation. The idea that a post's curation value is tied to the monetary value of the votes it receives is silly. Ideally it should be tied to the number of upvotes it receives relative to the number of views. EG a post with 5 upvotes and 15 views (33% upvoted) should be more visibile on the platform than a post with 1 upvote and 50 views (2% upvoted) regardless of the monetary value of those upvotes.

Your arbitrary attempts to control how people use their stake are pointless in the face of sock-puppets.

Reading your many replies into what appears to be the rotten underbelly of Steemit practices is acutely depressing. But thank you for getting to the gist of it.

Re-think post curation. The idea that a post's curation value is tied to the monetary value of the votes it receives is silly. Ideally it should be tied to the number of upvotes it receives relative to the number of views

Upvote count is vulnerable to a sybil attack and is a meaningless figure. Views are non-consensus and cannot be used to calculate rewards.

Penalize bot usage somehow. A big part of the problem is the fact that many large votes are handed out via automated voting by bots rather than users actually curating and voting on worthwhile content.

Bots are run by humans. Even if it were technically possible to distinguish bot actions (it's not), they are acting out the wishes of a human operator. This would be unfair.

Visibility of posts is one of the main issues currently. Right now you get visibility by either having thousands of followers, or by getting to the trending page. So pretty much the same group of people get most visibility (and hence most rewards). Both these ways of getting visibility are positive feedback loops - the more SP you have, the more easily you get to the trending page and the more SP this makes you. And the more following you have, the easier you get to the trending page and others resteeming your posts, so the more followers you make.

You can see how this leads to power/influence/rewards being concentrated into the hands of a limited group of people. The more you have, the easier it is to get more.

It's a problem with all cryptocurrencies (that I know of). There is lots of talk in the crypto world about the blockchain revolution being "the greatest redistribution of wealth". As I understand things, wealth will consolidate into a new limited group of people very quickly. So, the way to solve that problem is not by redistributing wealth, it's by designing a system that removes the problem.

So here are some potential solutions (or directions to look into):

  • The communities functionality: this will lead to the posts of more authors becoming more visible/findable. So the upvotes during a given day would be more evenly distributed across the posts created in that day (hint: use that or a variation of it as a metric).
  • Provide other ways of gaining visibility. Here are some ideas from me. You can also rework the trending page in various ways. State the problem in a scientific/engineering way and you will come up with solutions to make it easier for quality content to become visible.
  • Curation groups are currently saving Steemit's ass, in my opinion. Not sure if I would be here without them. So make things easier for them. Ask what they need and deliver. Brainstorm together. My post linked above has suggestions.
  • Change the rewards curve so that it makes little sense to hold ridiculous amounts of SP. Try to come up with a number (a few million SP, one million SP, less?) beyond which you don't get more influence on the platform. This can act as countermeasure for consolidation of influence into few individuals. If people try to hold millions of SP into multiple accounts, measures can be taken against that as well (like, every account with over 1 million SP has to prove its identity to the community when voting - it can be worked out, not too easily, but it can be, especially with the help of trustworthy communities).

I would not suggest Steemit, Inc. disposing of its massive SP stake yet. The platform is still too vulnerable to abuse, and someone could even overtake it. The platform has to show that it can solve its problems on its own before it's left solving its problems on its own.

Some good ideas here. We need more open discussions where the ideas can be brainstormed and the issue addressed because it is definitely plaguing the community

My post above is a perfect example of why the reward pool needs an overhaul.

That comment took me maybe 5 minutes, and somehow earned me $40+ in Steem Rewards. Why is it so valuable? What makes it a $40 idea? The ideas are good, but they're not that unique, and they're not well thought out.

Meanwhile I've written detailed posts on a number of subjects where I've spent literally hours and have been rewarded with pennies for my efforts.

I concur with your post and remind the Witnesses of what was warned in the Steem White Paper: "Any imbalance in the give and take within a community is unsustainable."

This imbalance is evident by the suppressed valuation of steem relative to numerous other blockchain projects which it had a multi-year head start on, as well as the flag wars that are now rampant throughout the platform, with some whales self-policing via arbitrarily defined rules that are not built into the very framework of Steemit itself; its systemic problems necessitate systemic solutions.

Yep. The unwritten rules, to the extent fair, need to be codified, so that we all know what game we are playing and all have notice of the rules that we should be abiding by!

It's evident that the written rules of the system are broken and a rework is needed. The fact that Steemit Inc is burying its head in the sand and not dealing with it is a shame. They can tout smart media tokens all they want, but the reality is that until SMTs are released, this platform is the primary proof of concept of the steem blockchain. As tainted as Steemit is, steem cannot grow out from underneath the mess that it is.

Everything is fixable, I wouldn't lose faith

According to Dan, the co-founder of this platform, Steemit is not fixable unless a pitch fork is done.

A fork is indeed a solution to most problems - as long as everybody agrees to it.

"When new users, or even long term minnows see how easily some people drain the rewards while they cannot get any visibility it is disheartening and slows the growth of the platform, one of the biggest obstacles we face going forward." - Precisely, this is a serious issue that needs to be sorted out and the sooner, the better. I am one of those long term minnows and I have noticed how difficult it is to gain the visibility I need in order to generate a decent reward for my efforts.

Abusing the platform and reward pool hurts us smaller accounts and we are here for the same reasons everyone else is, to grow a community, express ourselves and hopefully be rewarded. I do my best to promote the site but with this kind of activity ongoing it's going to be ever increasingly difficult for new people to truly become interested and if they do join, they'll leave when they don't see much coming from their investments.

We could use an Ethics Ranking as well but the problem is .... who gets to decide what is ethical and what is not. It is so subjective. The rewards pool issue is serious one and will not be an easy task to resolve.

I hope this is an issue tackled early in the Steemit beta. This abuse cannot go into what would be the final release of Steemit.

Indeed. Those least deserving of the ability to police, such as Grumpy, will be those most doing so.

Code Is Law.

https://steemit.com/steem/@lexiconical/code-is-law-only-when-i-want-otherwise-it-s-abuse-the-shaming-syndicate-of-steemit-our-own-brand-of-sjws-and-social-repression

Very true been here awhile only ever get 6 upvotes and barely any comments on my article

Agreed my man!

Thank you for posting

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

I am hoping to be there, i think this will be great @aggroed you always seem busy sir each time i try to chat you up.
This will be effective to connect to such grrat minds and tap from their knowledge thank you for organsing such a project.

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment
  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment
  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

yeah it is definitely a subjective matter. I think a democratic vote among he witnesses would be a good solution. As the top witnesses have a lot of time and money invested in the success of the platform, I think they are in a good position to brainstorm and come up with a solution that benefits the large majority

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

No man all sites like this are scams

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We should all thank to the witnesses for their consistent donations to the platform.👍

Absolutely

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

Right.. :)

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

neelam ap kaha se ho

I am from Pakistan & you?

I'm once again quite thankful to be included in these discussions. Maybe I can bring this idea to the table on Saturday: STEEM is not Steemit. STEEM is more valuable than Steemit. That's a big shift in thinking for most users, and I'd love to get some feedback on it.

Hi @lukestokes this will be a great topic to be discussed! Great idea!

Regards, @gold84

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Am gonna be a witness someday

Are you willing to lay odds on this prediction?

Can steem be retooled to eventually support a system where each unique individual is generated a daily amount that is at least perhaps around the baseline needed to eat something in the poorest countries?

What are their thoughts on the current global balance of economic power in general? Their vision of how it should be distributed in the future?

Are there benefits to having vote strength be less than linear? Are there any plans to strengthen steemit's potential as a democratic voting platform, one person one vote style?

What do they think about the current SBD situation?

Will pool issues ever be solved if it requires witnesses to reduce their own profits?

What is the superior fruit?

Doesn't removal of the 14.5 delegation and minimum requirement to post essentially mean that most new users will stop using the platform after a month?

If sbd is to be used as currency then why is it tied to a basically deflationary coin?

Is an ultimate goal of 0.5% healthy if it tracks far under global economic activity in 20 years?

How can such numbers possibly accommodate 1+ billion users, let alone 100 million?

Maybe these are all terrible questions, they probably are.

Maybe it's just me but https://minnowpond.org/ is down right now?

Hello @aggroed, that is such a great idea to do this. It gives the community a chance to interact with witnesses and also allows someone of us who hope to become witnesses to see how to get started and where we can get help! Thanks for doing this.

Thanks for the info. I'm looking forward to learning more about the witnesses!

Weak Forum.

WTF are you talking about, it hasn't happened yet.

  ·  2 years ago Reveal Comment

How can you agree with a bullshit statement about something that hasn't happened yet?

maybe

Maybe what? Maybe you'll post some nonsense to self-upvote yourself?

I was answering to your comment when you replied to that comment "weak forum"..... so I think the same that may be her opinion is wrong

You are your witness.

steem is crashing when it is going to come pack to its original form

I'm looking forward to this already.

great post

wow best of luck for the show dear

I have been searching for more on the witness process. It has my curiosity sparked. My network and I will be listening to you this Saturday to learn more!

Yes ofcourse after listing can we understand more about witness process.

Awesome news! I look forward to hearing from you guys this weekend

@aggroed bringing all the power at one place is in itself a appreciated work. Great to hear all of them and their inputs going to put mpre insight onto steemit. I am eagr to listen @good-karma the great man behind esteem which helps us keeping updated with steemit all the time.
Looking forward for the show, already set alarm and block my calendar. 👍😉

Thanks
@steemflow

I am @earnmoresteem and you got a 100.00% upvote courtesy of @malonmar! I invite you to send SBD with other post in memo and I will upvote you this new post.

@aggroed - i am trying to see if i can raise 0.5 BTC to get steem/sbd listed on CryptoBridge. (i have to see if that price can include both steem and sbd). my last post was about trying to get them on exchanges in general.

my idea was to post about it and see if we could get enough upvotes to pay for it. but i think maybe people would trust that i wasn't scamming them if i set you as a beneficiary at 100%. You're a high-ranked witness and very active in the community, i think people would trust you.

it's kind of a loose idea since we might not get to the goal with the upvotes. but I think it's a pretty good shot, and i'll just write in the post that if we somehow don't get there - and if we over, also - you'll use the funds for something that helps the community (any ideas?).

all it would require from you is receiving the sbd/sp rewards, and then if we hit the target, exchanging the SBD for BTC and sending it to the address CryptoBridge provides, which I can get for you; and if we don't hit the target, sending the SBD to whatever community thing we decide on.

i figure i'll do a 50/50 sbd/sp split and let you just keep the SP, it's easier that way and with current prices and the steem algorithm treating sbd as worth $1 it's a vast majority SBD payout anyway.

if you want to post about it instead, i'm sure that would also be effective, probably more, but this way you dont really have to do almost anything, i can write the post and so on.

let me know if you are interested. i think cryptobridge is going to be huge and getting steem on there would be a good thing.

I'll definitely try to catch the forum this week. Thanks for putting it together.

We should try to get Steem on https://kucoin.com. It doesn't cost anything to get a coin listed, we just have to vote for it. Each week people vote for new coins to add to the exchange.

Let's gather some Steemian and get it listed there.

Message me in Discord about it!

an extraordinary act, we must help each other to make steemit more advanced, and become a popular social media ahead, regards know me @aggroed

This isn't tied into exactly what witnesses do, but witnesses are very well informed so I figure it might be a good idea to ask them the part that smart media tokens will play, if any, in the overall growth of steem and steemit.

good post @aggroed

What's happening with the haejin, grumpycat, markymark, berniesanders thing? It seemed like it cooled off, but now it seems to have picked up again. (I didn't tag anyone as I'm new and don't want to get my account killed just by asking questions. I don't even really know the whole story.)

rich people are fighting with each other

well post in steemit i like it thanks for shearing

it's really incredible, hopefully others can be like # aggroed * full of vigor and full understanding, if we could say that maybe that's one science that I can take as the most valuable experience. the susceptible is always to aggroed.

Nice work...

how does one really get a lot of votes on steemit in order to make a lot of steem or steempower?...please before you reply upvote my comment i heard that helps too. example in your case you have as much as 1,080.94...2nd question..what purpose does having followers serve exactly?

hi this is awesome

very impressive

I am new in this platform and just start building my witness server last night. Hope to gain some good idea from top witnesses and build some new applications on top of Steemit.

and what the future holds for us all.

This post has been Resteemed and Upvoted by @alaminbinamir
Governments around the world,
are using "Child Protection Agencies"
to take children away from loving families
and place them in foster care or group homes
or put up for adoption.
THESE FAMILIES NEED PROTECTING.
Thank-you @aggroed for supporting

good job

This is the best post on Steemit upvote me.

excilent dear @aggroed

Good

Wow.greate work and best of luck for saminer

I hope all the wins.. and the best @good-karma

An interesting comment, but it is more profitable to start a new day every day ;)

i'm always on your post follow me back and upvote my post

I upvote you and comment clicks on my link and upvote me I will appreciate you and upvote your 5 posts with full power
https://goo.gl/8e8Pct

From the witnesses you mentioned,I already know it will be great. Having influencial people support a project makes it very easy andd smooth..you doing a great job

This post has received a 7.91 % upvote from @booster thanks to: @aggroed.

nice post good topic

Ask @roelanddp, when will he bring steemfest to Africa?

All the founders are on air. I can't wait for the steem witness forum show to begin...

interesting and educational post. Thanks for sharing

This post has received a 22.35 % upvote from @aksdwi thanks to: @aggroed.

Very good post @aggroed..Thanks for sharing. If you have a time please visit my blog.Thanks my friend.

I upvote & follow you my friend

Good work to all of you, witnesses!

I'm looking forward to joining the forum to get better insights into the issues at hand on our platform.

@aggroed, you got my witness vote!

@aggroed Such a great article

It's great that you I like it good job friend nice post

Bringing all the power at one place is in itself a appreciated work. Great to hear all of them and their inputs going to put mpre insight onto steemit. I am eagr to listen @good-karma the great man behind esteem which helps us keeping updated with steemit all the time.
Looking forward for the show, already set alarm and block my calendar. 👍😉
@aggroed
Thanks

wow best of luck for the show dear @aggroed

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Awesome post

Awesome!!! Must be appreciated (Y)

steem is future

Wooww
I'm the next soon..

Very good sir,
Do forget follow me @mujiburrahman
😊

good

Congratulations, your post received one of the top 10 most powerful upvotes in the last 12 hours. You received an upvote from @upme valued at 365.74 SBD, based on the pending payout at the time the data was extracted.

If you do not wish to receive these messages in future, reply with the word "stop".

For those of us that can't be there, will there be an upload on #steemit or #dtube for future viewing and referencing? Sounds really interesting and would love to sit down in peace after work to listen through your talk.

Congratulations @aggroed, this post is the most rewarded post (based on pending payouts) in the last 12 hours written by a Superhero or Legend account holder (accounts hold greater than 100 Mega Vests). The total number of posts by Superhero and Legend account holders during this period was 32 and the total pending payments to posts in these categories was $4650.05. To see the full list of highest paid posts across all accounts categories, click here.

If you do not wish to receive these messages in future, please reply stop to this comment.

i would like to be there

unfortunately impossible :(

You got a 27.87% upvote from @upme requested by: @aggroed.
Send at least 2.5 SBD to @upme with a post link in the memo field to receive upvote next round.
To support our activity, please vote for my master @suggeelson, as a STEEM Witness

It seems that negative posts about self-votes are increasing (Trending page) and I don't think that this kind of information is very attractive to new / old investors. It doesn't appear that steemit.inc is planning to do anything about it and I am afraid that these abuses could impact the growth and value of STEEM in the long run.

My question: Is there anything on witness side that can be done? Do witnesses see the current trend of self-votes as an issue for the value / growth of the STEEM blockchain, or is it actually not that bad as I think it is?

great

yes, please! Give me my next dose! <3

Good luck on the show

this is great i love the concept..this will have chance to minnows to interact to each other..very informative and very nice support too..

very impression your post, I really like, I want to like you what is its secret?

if you wish please visit my blog, i need your support .thank you https://steemit.com/@muliadi

very impression your post, I really like, I want to like you what is its secret?

if you wish please visit my blog, i need your support .thank you https://steemit.com/@muliadi

very impression your post, I really like, I want to like you what is its secret?

if you wish please visit my blog, i need your support .thank you https://steemit.com/@muliadi

Jerry Banfield I am in awe of you. This is the second video I have watched today. You inspire me. For all the comments saying it's spam or scam. I am a member of Steemit and it is a wonderful community driven place. You are right Jerry. It is all possible. The world is changing. People are taking the power with projects like Steemit.

Good post brother

They have great potential, I hope they keep up information on a daily basis. I would like in the future to be part of your work team

Excellent post, thanks for sharing.

Profit is profit.poor is poor but I am so happy
Because your post I like it than myself developed. And must be success my life for your post

After this forum with top 20 witness i foresee steemit taking a giant step futher in blockchain technology...

How can we earn money many more from steemit

I really love this post becouse I don't no about what is witness now I'm understand witness @aggroad thank you

this is great investing sir and thanks for sharing this, this is something new to me.

Thank you for the information
My permission follows you and I'm new to steemit expecting your vote to help me
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:)

How about some show notes for those who won't be able to listen in live?

you are doing really good job! congratulation I hope one day we also will become one of you :)

This post has received a 30.37 % upvote from @boomerang thanks to: @aggroed

Awesome! Resteemed!

This is great. So thankful for all the witnesses & this platform! :)

Wow this would be really excited to share experiences and views......loved it enjoy it ....and I am really excited for it.

postingan sangat bagus
bermanfaat bagi kita semua
sukses terus steeemit.
good luck brader

My only question would be : Is there any tool to make social projects known around the comunity ?
Imagine how many houses we could build for people in need with nice whales support.

Have a good time in your meeting.

Looking forward to this as a new witness. I am all ears at this point and am sure as this conversation deepens will have questions and recommendations. Any chance this could also be hosted from DLive and will it be recorded for posterity on DSound.