Why I'm Not Worried About Illegal Immigration

in #politics7 years ago (edited)

Illegal immigration has been a hot button issue during the recent news cycle with Trump getting elected and many former libertarians jumping on the nationalist bandwagon. Me personally, I remain libertarian, and I reject the notion that illegal immigration is a serious problem for freedom. I don't think that it's going to cause the demise of Western Society as some are saying. I can’t exactly speak to the situation in Europe because I've never even set foot there, but as for here in the U.S., I’m certainly unconvinced of that anyway.

I come at this from a rule that I've developed over the last decade or so of looking at societal ills. Now that I've connected many of those dots over that time period, I just short circuit to the question: "How is the government helping to cause this problem?" It's a very good question to ask because it's almost always the case that it is in some way.

So I look at the illegal immigration problem and ask how government is causing it. Well, first off, they've created the problem in the first place by making a group of criminals out of people who simply want to live in a new place. They haven't said, "come here freely, unless you want to violate the rights of our citizens." They've instead said, “you can't come here at all unless you get our permission, then when you do get here we'll help you violate the rights of our citizens if you vote for us.” You see the problem in this scenario isn't immigrants, the problem is the government. Without the government program called legal immigration, we wouldn’t have created these incentives for ne’er-do-wells to come here and screw us over.

I've heard the argument that if we let illegal immigrants come into the United States, they're going to illegally vote Democrat, along with their now legal children who will vote Democrat as well and then the socialists are going to politically overwhelm us. Having lived in Southern California over the last decade, I can say that I've met my fair share of people who come from Central and South America. Some of them are even illegal immigrants. As far as their belief systems go, it's been my observation that they resemble the conservative rural catholic people I grew up around in Upstate New York a lot more than your typical bleeding heart "liberals," who from urban and suburban areas here and vote Democrat. So what's the problem with them then?

Well, in my opinion the problem isn't with the immigrants, it's a problem of marketing. In many libertarians' quest for tribal solidarity with conservatives, they found the need to reject the very libertarian principles that held them all together in order to create an 'other' to fight against. Instead of trying to sell libertarian principals to these people that are the "enemy" of freedom, they've decided to be nationalists and exclude them from the discussion altogether, all but ensuring that the immigrants will in fact be the enemy and vote against them.

What's most insane about this whole libertarians-gone-nationalist thing is the notion that we're going to take a government program that's designed to keep people out of our borders, and use that to shrink said government. In keeping with the rule I talked about in the beginning of this post, I must ask another question: "Does the government have a strong track record of shrinking government when it is tasked with doing so?" The answer is a resounding NO.

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The USA was created as an experiment in small government, in which government itself would be hacked by the founders with a constitution that will cause it to limit its own power. Well, we've all seen the results of that. It ended up being the largest, most powerful government that was ever conceived by man. It's pretty safe to assume at this point that with most of what the government sets out to do, it will end up doing the opposite in the end. Declare war on poverty, you get more poverty. Declare war on terrorism, you get more terror. Declare war on drugs, you get bigger problems with drug addiction. This immigration issue will be no exception. Just like you can't make your economy stronger by stealing from the wealthy people and giving it to incompetent politicians, you're not going to shrink big government by growing it in some areas. This is the classic Republican line that has grown government in areas like “national security” and the police state while doing nothing about the welfare state and other leftist encroachments upon freedom. It is simply just being extended to the immigration issue.

That said, I cannot, and will not support the idea that a clamp down on illegal immigration is going to amount to a hill of beans in the quest to shrink big government. In fact, I think it's ultimately going to grow it in ways we haven't foreseen. This isn't because I have some crystal ball and I can see the future. No, it's because I've studied the past and I've seen this story before. It always ends the same way.

Image sources: Flag and Constitution

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Migration is a natural phenomenon for all species plants included (seeds do move). As long as it is natural, I don't mind it. I can speak for Europe as I am from there though.

As long as migration is natural, it is ok. People come and have to create effort to get money, flat etc. This is natural migration, when people move and expect themselves to work and not to be worked for.

In Europe, Germany created a kind of heaven-like reputation for itself in the areas of Southern Africa and partly Middle East. Migrants come and expect heaven to be granted for free. No effort required. This kind of migration is bad and stupid in its very own basic idea.

Furthermore, Germany now sues Czech Republic, Poland and Hungary for not helping with their hosts. Arguements of more eastern countries are strong, but can they stand against EU justice, if Germany, Greece or Italy have never been sued for their deeds? I doubt it.

European version of miggration is something I am very against. Might be an end of EU as more and more turn to the parties pursuing this idea.

Just one more thought: in EU parliament, there was suggestion for equal social benefits all over Europe. This would mean, they would get about 20-times more money in Czech Republic, than average working person does. This is current EU!

Yeah the situation isn't exactly the same here in the U.S. although I'm sure there are some similarities. It's hard to tell from the outside what exactly is going on in Europe right now because the news media are so unreliable. Most are propagandizing on both sides of the issue, so it's difficult to sort out. I don't think it's a good idea to use tax dollars to promote and transport and house people from other countries who have no hope of integrating into that society.

Standpoint of most of our popular politicians and me as well is exactly what you say. They want to help in the areas, where the problems emerged including slave-trade, wars, insufficient supplies of water, bully from the side of troublesome companies and more. I fully agree with you. We should not spent money on encouraging migrants to come and stay, if they are not benefical to people, who earnt the money in the first place.

I think the US has more appeal to undocumented migrants willing to stay underground because it has less of a welfare state than most wealthy countries.

We don't have universal healthcare. We have employer-based insurance, and private health insurance.

We don't have a rigorous licensing system for driving. We have some simple tests, but we move a lot of the costs into insurance, which is sold in the private market. So people pay $200 or so to get the privilege to drive, but $600 to some insurance company. On a $3000 car. And the insurance company can raise your rate.

Insurance covers some of the functions of the government, so a person can "buy their government" via insurance.

Credit is given based on pay stubs or other proof of income. The law allows undocumented people to operate a business. 1/3 of the working class are on a 1099, and that's what they can do to make money.

We have a lot of flea markets, so people can start businesses at a low cost.

We have very little public housing. Instead, we allow some slum conditions. "Slum conditions" are our affordable housing program. We also have rent control in some large cities, and that is a market reform that functions for all tenants regardless of immigration status. (Public housing rules don't count the undocumented individuals in a household.)

I'm not saying this as any kind of ideological argument. I'm a communist- anarchistic-tending progressive. I like immigrants, hate countries and nationalism, and still want social welfare. So, contradictions aren't only on the right wing that's drifting toward fascism. It's also on the left wing drifting toward communism.

  1. Legality does not define morality
  2. Government borders are not analogous to property lines.
  3. Travel without government permission is not a crime against person or property
  4. If A robs B and gives the crumbs to C, how is it rational for B to blame C while giving more power to A?

I wish we had a better notification system for this platform. Just saw this comment for the first time. All very good points.

Ha! Better late than never though, right?

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