The challenge of reason... how do you reveal reason to those who don't know how to use it?
I've watched a lot of debates (though they were more a person yelling and insisting they were right and not listening) lately. For some of these people the thing I've been wondering is how do you get them to stop yelling long enough to learn and listen?
The term Fake News for example. Another reason it is backfiring is some of the people use it as ANYTHING I DON'T LIKE. It is not actually based upon facts, it is pure emotion and not liking some belief of theirs being challenged. This is irrational. How do we go about waking these people up?
When I say waking up... I am not saying GET THEM TO AGREE with anything in particular.
I am saying to wake them up to using their own minds and teach them how to once again listen.
Here are some things I'd like to tell everyone (for my actual targets would likely believe I am not talking to them):
- Everyone is wrong about things. Far more often than you may suspect.
- If someone said something you disagree with... did they back what they said with something you can research?
- Did the person use an absolute, all, every, never, everyone, etc?
Let's look at what these three points can do for you as a person. They actually can help ALL (applies in this case) of us.
Everyone is wrong about things
It is okay to be wrong. It is actually GOOD to be wrong as long as we acknowledge it and learn from it. You will rarely learn more than when you allow things you are wrong about to be corrected. Refusing to listen simply because we don't like what someone has said at any point is actually you shutting down the doors of communication. You can listen without agreeing, but it is important to actually LISTEN and HEAR what the person says. We all are potentially wrong on any issue we hold dear.
Did they give you something researchable?
Did the person that you disagree with and don't like what you are hearing actually give you anything that you can research? If so, this is a good thing. It doesn't mean they are right or you are wrong. It does however, give an avenue for you to determine that. Also it is important to know RESEARCH is not talking to people you agree with. Actually go and use google and look up the information. If you want to make sure that you are getting the best information try to find people talking about it who are one side of information, and those who are on the other. If any of them are pushing agendas then by comparing them you'll hopefully get the details either(or multiple) side is intentionally leaving out to make their agenda make more sense. This is a danger with research. What information did someone choose to leave out so you would be more likely to agree with them?
All, Every, Never, Everyone
I have used some of these in this article. Yet I double checked and I do believe in the places I used them they are actually applicable.
These are called absolutes.
When talking about absolutes they are very rarely true. So when a person chooses to use them they can immediately invalidate what they are saying. The absolute made their statement untrue. This is important to know not simply so you can decide things are untrue. It is important so you TOO will try not to use absolutes except when they are true.
Examples:
All Alt-Right people are Nazis and White Supremacists.
All people on the left are communists.
Both of those statements are false. You would be safest replacing the word with Some, Most, A lot, etc. Those do not simply try to dump all the people under a label into your bucket.
I recently actually argued about that first one concerning the Alt-Right. I didn't argue because I am Alt-Right, Left, etc. I argued because of the absolute and I knew that made the statement false.
The person proceeded to share a lot of websites I had never heard of or been to and some people like Richard Spencer that I had seen a video of once before, but kind of forgot him. So I learned some things in the research.
I also learned that the statement WAS indeed false because of the existence of the word. All. In the case of that statement the word Some, or saying "The original alt-right" would have been true.
In my research I found Richard Spencer on a wayback machine copy of a web page using that term in 2009. In researching Richard Spencer he definitely pushes the white supremacist, and nazi agenda. So his core adherents that began with him tend to also carry this same agenda. This would imply that it is likely there was a period where all of Alt-Right were white supremacists. Yet even that is dangerous to say all. Talking to a white supremacist, and knowing a white supremacist does not mean you have to agree with the person. Guilt by association is also a falsity. It does not meet the burden of proof. It may prove they associate with people that have ideas you find distasteful, yet it does not prove they share those ideas.
I also knew that ALL was false in that statement because I'd been encountering a lot of people calling themselves Alt-Right, and Alt-Right media and it was clear they were not white supremacists or nazis. I've encountered more in my research.
Labels in general are dangerous to generalize/stereotype around. They are simply WORDS. Where the person first encountered them matters a great deal. Did they encounter them because they were listening to Richard Spencer and decide they were Alt-Right too? If so then they very well may be white supremacist. Did they encounter them because they were reading an article on infowars, zero hedge, etc that was talking about alt-right and had nothing to do with white supremacy? If they were then deciding they were alt-right based upon what they encountered there would not suddenly make them a white supremacist. In fact that is but TWO examples of how someone might encounter that and truly there are an infinite variety of ways people might encounter something.
I guarantee you that a lot of the people calling themselves Alt-Right don't know who Richard Spencer is. They likely have never been to websites like Stormcaller.
I explained this to my friend I was debating that absolute with. He stated then they shouldn't be using that label. I tried to explain to him that a person choosing to use a label based upon information they KNOW is all they can do. They have no way of knowing EVERYTHING and thus even being aware there is another distasteful group using the same label. He didn't quite agree with me on this YET.
The key thing about absolutes of All, Never, Everyone, Every, etc is that it only takes ONE case where that is not the case to invalidate your entire statement. So if you want to be closer to what you likely intend while not speaking a false statement then use a qualifier such as most, a lot, some, a few, etc.
Yet I will warn you now there are media outlets that like to use phrases like "some people say" as though that was important when reporting the news. In many of those cases the SOME PEOPLE they were referring to was the reporter themselves. They might as well have said I SAY. Instead they leave a vague sourceless SOME out there in the hope you'll buy into the bandwagon and agree because there are some people saying that. Sadly, this works on a lot of people. This is what I am trying to change.
Waking up, freeing your mind, and using critical thinking does not mean you have to agree with anyone including me. In fact, you should be an individual and not agree with ANY (absolute) other individual completely. You are your own person, you have your own mind. Use it, exercise it, make it stronger, make it faster, make it more resistant to manipulation.



I'm calling my local thought-police. You're done for! That's it! Finished!
Heheh. :) It is very possible I am on one or more lists for things I've said over the years.
Interesting and on point, would appreciate your insight into the topics I covered in my last post, am reaching out for input as this real news/fake news saga has me confused and disillusioned
https://steemit.com/life/@daisyd/365-days-that-count-day-51-what-is-actually-going-on-with-the-world-an-open-debate-on-presidentsday-2017
nicely written; resteemed
Yeah there is too much fighting on here lately, we all to hug out it... virtually... I'm not sure how that will work but you get the point.
Discussion/Debating/Disagreements are good. It is how we learn. I have no problem with that. As soon as we go NAH NAH NAH and stick or fingers in our ears, or we start making fun of the person trying to talk to us, or insulting them then that becomes a bad thing. :)
There is some of that here, but it is WAY LESS than anywhere else I've ever seen.
What! I disagree. NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH. :p
Yeah I hear you. It could be a lot more civil on here with the discussions. It's only scaring people away.
The sad thing is that it is way more civil on here than just about anywhere else I know.
Civility is two way streak. Some people get angry for their treatment yet they treat people that way as well.
Not saying this is you. I am simply stating as an example. I don't like hypocrisy and yelling at people for being uncivil and insulting is something I often see from people that are uncivil and insulting.
We can all improve in that regard. Getting better at that seems like it can only be a good thing. Win/Win.
Steemit seems to have bubbles of hostility, and then times of peace. Other platforms I've been to seem to have seas of hostility with floating barges of peace... can you make it to a barge?
I am a barge, I've got nothing bad to say about no one :).
Careful Dwinblood, this information can be used for evil as well as good ;)
Every tool can be used for good an evil. Good and evil are also very subjective and depend a lot on culture, religion, etc. Those are not battles I have any interest in fighting.
I only want people to become aware of critical thinking and get better at it. That has become my personal mission in terms of thinking "what can I do to help?" For me... that is to get people talking and thinking about critical thinking.
I don't think any of the grand solutions people have to the "big" problems can actually be viable for very long or in some cases at all without a population that is well versed in critical thinking.
I will not tell people what they can and cannot think. If they have critical thinking(aka reason) as something they embrace regularly then I or people like me should be able to at least have REASONABLE debates/discussions with them.
I personally believe one of the things that is most EVIL is an unwavering mind that is unwilling to consider it may be wrong. So much of what we term "evil" found its foundation in such minds.
So, you are saying eventually, you will come across to the dark side?
We can leave the heavily flawed concepts of good and evil are for another discussion.
Heh... Oh I love a good discussion on Good and Evil. Yet like you said "another discussion".
So many things that claim to be good are some of the most evil things on the planet as far as I'm concerned...
I tend to look at actions rather than words...
To get a feel for where I am in most of that I can link some far older posts I made (it will also help me to find them again if we DO end up having such a debate/discussion/powwow):



If you were to read those posts... aspects of those likely flavor a lot of my view on Good/Evil, Darkside/Lightside, etc.
They don't define it in its entirety as even I don't know that. I tend to learn more about myself as I ponder such things. I also change my mind frequently. :)
I will give them a glance before bed. A little light reading by the sounds of it.
Further glimpse into who I am. Though I do change my mind. :)
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