First of all I want to state that I am a bible believing Christian and I also have a Master's Degree in Computer engineering. I very much appreciate this post for its authenticity along side its tolerant tone. I have found in intelligent circles that debates about religion tend to resort to name calling and a lot of "How could you believe..." from both sides of the fence and this post does not do that which is a very good place to be in order to have a healthy discussion.
I do want to respond to a couple of things from this post though.
Testing of Faith
One of the outcomes of the discussion was the stance that God is testing our faith. If we fail to believe then we have failed the test.
Everyone who reads the Bible either believes it or doesn’t. This is God’s explicitly stated intent.
It’s a filter. You get to filter yourself out by deciding you’d rather invent your own rules and philosophy.
Based upon this position, anyone who never has the opportunity to take the test fails. I simply chose to adopt the fate of everyone who was not exposed to the test. I chose this route because there is no compelling evidence that the test is real.
What I believe about my religion does not agree with your conclusion. I believe that all humans have an internal moral code, essentially built right into our DNA. This has taken away our excuse that we have never heard the truth. We can see order and beauty and complexity in nature and we should all have an innate understanding that God does exist.
For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
Romans 1:20
This may seem a "cop out" but in fact if you read the very next chapter of Romans I believe it is not:
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
Romans 2:12-16
What I interpret this to mean is that you do not need scripture to know the truth. Gentiles in those days did not have access to scripture, and as it says here they can still be counted righteous in God's sight. Ultimately, taking the whole of the bible into account, I interpret this to say that it's not about following the letter of the law. Belief shows in the desire to follow the law. While you may not succeed to never tell a lie or to never covet your neighbor's property, you do not ultimately want to do those things and you are genuinely remorseful. This is true belief. This is also why such a huge portion of the bible deals with repentance and forgiveness.
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 1:9
A second thing I want to respond to is your choice to bring up the story of how hard it is for a rich man to get into heaven. While this story is valid, I think it misses the point of how easy it truly is to get into heaven. Consider the two criminals crucified along side Jesus. All it truly takes is belief that Jesus is God and that He is the only one who can truly take away our sin because He was the only human to ever be punished and not be guilty. In doing so He took the punishment that we all deserve since we are without excuse.
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”
40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”
42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[d]”
43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
Luke 23:39-43
I just want to say again that I appreciate your honesty. Keep true to yourself and be honest with yourself whether you believe in what I do or not. God very much appreciates honesty and hates hypocrisy. This can be clearly seen throughout the gospels. Jesus' angriest moments are directed at the Pharisees who preached the word but were dead in their hearts. And his most loving moments were directed at those who were living in sin.
I hope I have given you a better picture of what I believe is "honest Christianity". I do love a good debate too though so feel free to respond. :)
Thanks for this. The thief on the cross example points out the simplicity of belief and that it doesn't require mastery of all the details provided in the Bible. But belief means accepting who Jesus is and that imply's obedience. Jesus' last words to his disciples included this command:
Jesus wants more than mere believers,
he wants disciples who will obey His teachings,
and therefore recursively make more desciples
who will obey His teachings.
The Bible is simply the best record we have
of what those teachings were.
With belief comes an ernest desire to know what Jesus wanted passed along.
Who ya gonna call?
Thanks for your reply. I confess that in the interest of brevity my arguments and positions did not attempt to address the greater nuances brought up in your post.
I can honestly say that my true beliefs are compatible with the bible and that I would qualify for going to heaven based upon my interpretation of the bible. Verses like you quoted show that there is solid support for my attempt to adhere to the greatest commandments while systematically ignoring anything that cannot be derived from it puts me in a safe place.
Everything else is a matter of abstract labels and ideas which I believe are meaningless.
"He was the only human to ever be punished and not be guilty."
Well, that's a little bit of an overstatement, don't you think? I'm no one special, and I have certainly been punished for things that I was not guilty of doing. In fact, I think that is a not uncommon occurrence. Power possessing beings often project their crimes onto, and punish, the innocent.
I can see how you may misinterpret that sentence. It's not that Jesus was innocent of one thing. He was innocent of EVERY thing. And He chose to be punished in our place. That is the difference. No other human that I am aware of has chosen that fate.