You are viewing a single comment's thread from:
RE: Proof of Stake Coins as (almost) free way to multiply your holdings.
It is not free, because the holder is staking, and that is the "real labor" according to pos guidelines. Hence the "(almost)" in the title.
no its not. Having money isn't labor, that's stupid.
Stupid is, as stupid does.
Why the mentioning of money? The author didn't mention that term or word you are referring to. How are you defining that word? The word "money" is abstract and has biblical origins directly synonymous with "gods" whom your profile name claims to deny. What money is, or is not, is irrelevant to this article.
Once again, it's not free because; ACCORDING TO PROOF OF STAKE GUIDELINES aka the system set forth by the authors of the token requires a computer to be functioning and ready to complete and verify a circuit. If you don't like the rules then don't play the game.
My intention is not to insult or say that you are wrong; or to defend pos tokens. It is, however, to question the terms and presuppositions this article seems to have attached to it with some.
capital, sorry just trying to use terms you people understand lmao
Think of it like an investment or like a savings account at a bank. You deposit a bunch of money and over time, it grows. That's the basic concept of POS coins.
The more you buy, the bigger the investment and hence more money in your pocket. When you buy more, it raises the price of the coin and therefore those early adopters get a higher ROI. So on and so forth.
resources have to come from somewhere. That extra money comes from the labor of the workers
It's a similar concept with nodes on other POS coins as well. Those who manage the nodes, are investing money on servers and get a share of the profits
have you ever heard of the labor theory of value?
Not really..... Please elaborate?
So I did some research and as it turns out, money on steemit doesn't come out of thin air. There are those who actually manage the nodes (and get a certain percentage of the block rewards) so technically speaking, you could consider them the miners who are managing this blockchain..... Hope that makes sense....
I don't get what workers you're talking about over here. If by workers you mean those who manage the nodes then yes. They have volunteered for this and get paid for it with a certain percentage of each block's rewards. They are also investing their time, energy and money and we can be considered the employees of this firm where we produce content and get paid for our work
it's somewhat like if you were to lend your money to someone, they use it to make profits and give you a % of the profits. You can't access those funds without losing your stake from there on in, you deserve to get rewarded for that.
"you deserve to get rewarded for that."
so you deserve what somebody produces because they do not have the resources to take stuff from others themselves? So let me guess, you support hitler? You support the system that causes 20 million to die a year from poverty in the name of fairness?
That escalated quickly. You know that Steemit relies on staking right? The algorithm is somewhat more democratic since it is delgated proof of stake, but the whales still hold enormous power and can decide who gets to stake. There are other algorithms out there that we can debate the merits of, but why are we talking about Hitler?
"somewhat more democratic"
as democratic as a guy with a gun saying he is right commanding others because he has a better weapon
Why are you supporting Steemit with your time and energy if you fundamentally oppose the system that underpins it? Are you going to call Dan a fascist next? You act like you have all the answers and the rest of us are lucky to have your insights to set us straight. Remind you of anyone?
"Why are you supporting Steemit with your time and energy if you fundamentally oppose the system that underpins it? "
"why do you work for a labor camp for hitler. Food and water? I don't care you are supporting hitler"
"Why do you work for your feudal lord if you hate the system so much? Be glad for the rags he gives you"
Steemit runs on open source code, you are perfectly free to fork it and build a more egalitarian system. I for one would be happy to see that. No one is forcing you to keep using it.
"Are you going to call Dan a fascist next? "
Hitler was supported by the vast majority of business owners in germany. Profit margins are profit margins
I fundamentally disagree with every system under capitalism. The entire system is build on slavery. You can not escape it, so the only option if you oppose slavery is to use the system to end itself.
"but why are we talking about Hitler?"
ruling class is ruling class, dictator is dictator. I am showing you how your procapitalist propaganda applies to capitalists people don't like too
I'm confused...... are you referring to Hitler as a capitalist that "people don't like too"?
If so, history 101: Hitler was a Nazi, which is a German abbreviation for Nationalsozialists, or National Socialist. Socialism is almost the exact opposite of capitalism, let alone Nationalism.
Just to clarify.
actually hitler privatised all national industry and give it away to the ruling class. National socialism is just capitalism by another name.
here is a nice video on the topic
"That escalated quickly. "
no. I am telling you the effects your preferred system is having today. If you think it escalated quickly you were deluding yourself.
quite interesting! So you don't believe in savings? how do you explain savings?
saving =collection of labor surpluses.
as labour has value=money
saving =collection of values(money)
if there is no incentive to hold values(staking) then wouldn't the value itself lose value
and money would be just a paper?
savings is keeping value you created for the future. Investment on the other hand is taking resources from others (profit) without doing labor yourself. In other words it is slavery.
"if there is no incentive to hold values(staking) then wouldn't the value itself lose value"
true value how much socially necessary labor it takes to create an object. I don't care about the price of stupid coins.
"and money would be just a paper?"
That's all it is right now, we just pretend it has value.
If you don't care about the price of stupid coins, then why are you entering a discussion on an article about cryptocurrencies?
I read all of your comments and wonder if you just want to argue.
"Investment on the other hand is taking resources from others (profit) without doing labor yourself. In other words it is slavery."
Incorrect. Investment is risking capital. The terms of how investors are rewarded for taking that risk is measured as rate of return or ROI. A person or entity holding a significant stake in crypto is taking a risk. PoS ensures that people participating in the system have a proven stake in the system this ensures that the actions they take will be in the best interest of the system.
Debt is a form of bondage (slavery if you prefer) it is a contract to repay what was borrowed with interest to account for risk and opportunity costs that the investor bears.
"Incorrect. Investment is risking capital"
on average capitalism must make profit, or it will literally collapse. So its like saying a casino risks all their money because they are gambling.
"PoS ensures that people participating in the system have a proven stake in the system this ensures that the actions they take will be in the best interest of the system."
Is upvotig yourself the best interest of the system?
also I really don't care how currency is used, I'm talking about capital.
"Debt is a form of bondage (slavery if you prefer) it is a contract to repay what was borrowed with interest to account for risk and opportunity costs that the investor bears."
When a person has no choice in life but to borrow money, college, a house, a car, or even food can put him into that position. It is mass slavery and there is no way to justify it.
"Is upvotig yourself the best interest of the system?"
I am new here and have no idea how upvoting works. I will say that the incentive of people participating in a system need to aligned with the best interest of that system or that system can not be trusted. That is as true for a crypto-currency as it is for the voting system of a representative republic.
"When a person has no choice in life but to borrow money, college, a house, a car, or even food can put him into that position. It is mass slavery and there is no way to justify it."
So everyone is entitled to a house they didn't build, a car they didn't pay for and food they didn't grow just because they were born? That is a very childish and ignorant view. There is no incentive for anyone to INVEST their time (yes time is an investment) to produce any of those things unless there is a direct benefit to them. Stop with the nonsense.
There is no capitalism today, it's oligarchy, socialism and fascism paraded around as capitalism. IT IS A LIE.
Everyone should be angry; we've been cheated, lied to and enslaved. Plantations and slave owners are gone but the US has become the plantation with globalist slave owners. Our lives and the lives of our children have been sold to globalists and banks who rob everyone through inflation and deflation all while creating war and division between countries, races and religions.
"So everyone is entitled to a house they didn't build, a car they didn't pay for and food they didn't grow just because they were born? "
so every business owner is entitled to the products they didn't build and the profit they didn't make?
Free market capitalism is as much of a fantasy as utopian society in socialism....two extreme form of human imagination.....can never happen why?.....GREED
So i am better of promoting my fev coin at the moment
DNR pos coin earn free dnr by joining slack https://steemit.com/cryptocurrency/@rajankc/denarius-cryptocurrency-check-out-the-new-video
Would not that all be an utopian fantasy....have not we gone too far already?
is it not accepted values in our current interpretation of free market democracy?
( you may question the integrity of free market)
That
We are constantly manufactured to be competative and greedy, furthermore, being greedy is encouraged,as a result,casino definately florish, Overconsumption lead to overproduction that generates even more debt, more debt= more necessities - more necessities bring up more invention. And we are constantly competing in the name of individul freedom.
greed and debt are the foundation that generate our necessities & creativity.
Quantitative easing , print money out of thin air, currency devalue, crypto arise ...we definately evolving regardless...i guess crypto is the best answer to mould conventional model of free market into more accepted method.
Main point: staking is necessary to preserve our current acceptance of free market values, incentives are the rule of the game... cryptos are here to survive and cant affort to be radical altogether.
"greed and debt are the foundation that generate our necessities & creativity." wrong
in a free market the only thing that's free is the market.
I would never assume we had free market ever..
Production is only for more profit than the real need....is not that greed
DNR pos coin earn free dnr by joining slack https://steemit.com/cryptocurrency/@rajankc/denarius-cryptocurrency-check-out-the-new-video
http://anticapitalismfaq.com/
@leesmoketree I recommend that you enter https://goo.gl/d4ZFjk you will get 50 free WCX Tokens and 15% if you want to invest, this currency is now in the PRE-ICO stage and is the best time to invest!