Random Thread #3: Path Birds

in CEO Champion's Gate4 years ago (edited)

There are four ways to do a powerful path bird unit.

A short gryphon with kingmelee - Fire Bird (A) - values simplicity and coverage
A short aanca with kingmelee - Ice Bird (B) - values duplicity and coverage
A short leaping gryphon - Lightning Bird (C) - values simplicity and power
A short leaping aanca - Water Bird (D) - values duplicity and power

PieceMaker-Fire Bird (A).png

For (C) and (D) the path anchor is the green Knight squares, so the black squares can be blocked and the path still usable.

The first two people to give feedback on these units and cost these units will be awarded 20 RP.

Edit: Both RP prizes have been awarded.

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First of all: Since we're talking birds, have you ever heard of the Flying Kingfisher?? It's my favorite fantasy chess piece, or at least the one with the best name.

for the 4 listed birds...

  • Firebird (A) is nominally Man plus Knight plus Camel, minus the ability to jump. Man plus Knight is already very close to Dragon, which is valued around 15ish (a case could be made to drop it to 14, but that's neither here nor there). Similarly, base Fortress is currently 16 and this is probably about similar in power. Overall I would expect Firebird to cost 15ish.
  • Icebird (B) is also Man plus Knight but adds Zebra (3,2) paths instead of Camel paths. Although they control the same amount of territory, more of Icebird's squares are forward-pointing, which I view as slightly more positive than the sideways defensive nature of Firebird. Overall Icebird could be either 15 or 16; I suspect some would cost it at 16 and I think I would agree.
  • Lightning Bird (C) is Knight plus Ferz plus Camel-path. This piece seems obviously weaker than Firebird due to the missing Wazir spaces, but some value gets added back for the ability to jump. The holes in Lightning Bird's control area make it feel more similar to Archbishop than Fortress, even though it's a more Rook-shaped movement style. Whether this piece or Waterbird below is more valuable probably depends on whether a Knight appreciates the addition of Ferz or Wazir more. For now I'd stick it at 12 and see if it needs a nerf later.
  • Waterbird (D) is the easiest to cost: it's a Knight++ with some extra (3,2) pathing. This addition feels similar to the extra value provided by Legionary+ over base Legionary, although we're adding 8 squares instead of 4 and they're move/attack squares rather than just attack only. Maybe a more apt comparison would be to current Valkyrie+++, which is 14, although Waterbird can't snipe the back row from the 5th the way Valkyrie can, and the King teleports must also be worth something. Overall, Waterbird feels like a 12-13 point piece, leaning more towards 12.

Considering the fact that you would value waterbird at 12 this makes knight+++ seem absurdly bad in comparison

I actually do think knight+++ is pretty bad. Knight++ at 10 is already not all that great.

 4 years ago Reveal Comment

The first two seem a bit like fortress and archbishop. All four of them have their own strengths and weaknesses, as the first two are not weak to kingmovers while the last two are. In general I do feel the first set of two is quite a bit stronger, although the 2nd two have an unblockable the first two can attack around more and are much safer due to their kingmove.

moltress: This unit can be used to control the center of the board very easily, Although it has some weak spots, its path is NOT limited to just attack like fortress/archbishop giving it a lot more power. It can easily move very far in a matter of turns. I would say 17 cost, as the kingmove and the move-and-attack of the paths make it quite powerful even without the middle attack Along with that the move squares on normal fortress those allow a unit to block the path, making this much stronger.... As a fire bird why no magic destroy or create fireball?

arcticuno: Diagonals in my opinion are weaker than straights, many things can easily get by them and the diagonals themselves are color locked. This units new attack squares also allow it to kill things blocking the paths. As with fortress and archbishop I think it deserves to be 1 less cost at 16... as an ice bird, why no freeze?

zapdos: It can be powerful due to the path taking on the power of the unblock able, however without kingmove it is a bit weaker due to that weakness It can still attack where things are blocking it, especially since those are unblockables. As its a lot easier to kill this unit I feel 14 or even 13 cost.... as a thunder bird why no lightning

swanna? theres no legendary water pokemon bird: Same logic with the first set, the diagonals basically anti-color-lock this unit, when its on white it has to move to black. That makes it much weaker due to the lack of moves so I would even go for 12. Also if its a water bird... why no waterelemental magic squares?

 4 years ago Reveal Comment
 4 years ago 

This post has received a 28.91 % upvote from @boomerang.

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