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RE: Hip hop culture promotes immaturity
"Jeez that Jazz culture sure makes kids do a lot of heroin, look at how many of them jazz musicians are junkies!"
Hip-hop is a lot more than the rap music you are obviously referencing. For example, How can break dancing or turntablism promote the things you are complaining about. You are off-base in your generalization.
You made a comparison to jazz, which is a misdirection tactic, but you failed to prove how hip hop promotes maturity. I have been watching the decline since at least 1980. So I have 37 years of proof and experience in the subject matter. People who step back from pride and being a "fan"(fanatic) tend to see exactly what I am talking about.
Proof? You have hardly provided anecdotal evidence. Why is the burden of proof on me? You're the one making a claim. I'm not saying hip-hop promotes anything. I'm just stating the fact that Hip-hop is a collection of art forms that comprise a culture. Dj-ing, Breakdancing, beatboxing, beat-making, graffitti art, and rapping; these are capable of promoting neither maturity nor immaturity, nor anything else for that matter.
How does an art form make the people who consume it do anything? Does viewing a Goya painting make people go eat their children? Does listening to a Wagner opera turn somebody into a racist? If your claim about a type of music ( in this case Rap which you are broadly painting as "hip-hop") causing immaturity was sound, then by the same accord of your reasoning, heavy metal fans everywhere , after 40+ years of hearing lyrics about devil worship and violence, would be killing people in massive numbers and practicing black magic when in reality they are not, and jazz fans everywhere would be addicted to heroin like their heros Charlie Parker, Billie Holiday and many others.
You did exactly what I thought you would do. Okay, hip hop, which includes rap, is a culture with music that is typically geared towards the youth. There are few over 40 rappers who are widely accepted as active artists. The newer artists are typically very young. Their young concepts and mindset are linked to there often unwise, violence driven, drug use promoting lyrics. It should not have to be said that it is not all artists. I can pull up the top 25 rap songs of today, combed through the lyrics and show and prove that they absolutely do not encourage growing up and being a responsible adult. The artform was build upon anti-mainstream culture, in essence, rebellion. Now, you went back to jazz and tried to use that again. Comparisons don't prove your point. They only bring in extensions to the conversation. I have to break it to you real simple and plain, you will never prove your point or argument concerning hip hop. It is okay to be a fan of it if you want, but it is what it is. Just face the truth of the matter.
Seeds of influence - not saying that is making anyone do anything. However, do not discount the power of influence. That is precisely why you are trying to protect hip-hop. I have to laugh a bit because I literally see men in their 50s and 60s still dressing "hip-hop". It is hilarious and sad to see them try to look like they are in their 20s and it does not match. Proof! I have seen "hip-hop" influence guys in their 20s and 30s in regards to how they dress when they are with their woman in the store. The woman, dressed nicely, looked like the man's mother and he looked like the little brother or son. Proof! Hip-hop promotes sagging pants (and more). Not a sign or maturity. Proof! I can do this all day. Shall we bring in the lyrics, more about the clothing, slang words and other influences of hip-hop? Now, the minority part of promoted hip-hop, in essence a small percentage of it, is positive. The only major promotion of maturity within hip-hop is on the money making side in the board rooms of the businesses. What is promoted to the fans is for them to stay immature and rebellious. They do it because that is where the money is. Now, notice how I am staying on point and don't need to talk about dead jazz musicians or Goya.