Why do you think there is so much hate and anger toward Vegans, and why are those who eat meat and dairy so threatened by the notion of giving it up?

in ecotrain •  3 months ago


Before I start Id like to say that i was brought up eating meat and only meat.. i barely ate a vegetable or fruit until I was 21 years old when I visited India for the first time and decided to not eat meat during that 5 month journey as i was told its easy to get ill.. It was quite liberating to learn how tasty vegetables could be when cooked with some good spices! After that I was a 100% vegetarian for a few years, and today I eat meat about once a month or so. I am also MOSTLY vegan and eat dairy fairly rarely, usually involving a pizza like I did today for lunch. OK so with that out of the way here we go!

I would like to being by asking a question! If you were walking down the street and saw someone beating a poor defenceless puppy to an inch of its life, would you be justified in stopping them? Is that any of your business? Well I sure would and YES i would MAKE it my business! So as far as I am concerned, people who make an issue or speak up in defence of animals are likewise quite justified in doing what they can to protect animals from our ever increasing global population meat demand.

Last week there was an event that happened in Brighton UK, where a group of protesters went into a steakhouse and played the sounds of animals being slaughtered and showed pretty disturbing images for a good half an hour. Needless to say it didn’t go down to well, and most meat eating guests were fairly cheesed off! One one hand i have to say that is not cool, and I don’t think i would ever do that, but on the other hand I think they are hero’s and am proud of them for doing what they feel they need to do to stand up for the rights of animals who have no voice or ability to stop the cruelty and travesty that is mass farming today. If we don’t speak up for them then who will? Serious issues can require drastic action, and the state of our animal farming today is something that surely requires some kind of action. Once you have seen or learned of the truth behind mass animal farming you may start to understand why they do this.

With that said, the question this week is not whether Vegans are justified in their actions and words but rather why people hate them so much for trying to speak out at all, and indeed why it upsets meat and dairy eating folk so much. From what I can see, vegans get a VERY poor reception despite the fact that they are basically against murder and torture which really isn’t such a bad thing is it?

SO why!? What is going on here? Well here is what I think!

Carnal Desire

We are also animals, let us not forget, and we have carnal desires just like any other animal. Those of us who eat meat simply do NOT want to give it up. It is a part of our natural instinct (for many of us) and the notion of giving it up is one that produces great resistance. When we challenge our most primal needs that is the result, it is that simple! People generally do not WANT to know quite how bad it actually is for animals,, out of sight .. out of mind.. It's very easy to be totally disconnected from what actually happens when we buy perfect clean looking meat from a supermarket. SO since most meat eaters don’t even know what really goes on behind the scenes they get even more upset at opposition to their dietary habits. I am sure that if those people who really do hate vegans were to ACTUALLY go and see a large scale farming operation they would most likely change their tune.. and at the VERY least would only buy and eat free range organic ethical meat.

Sadly there is not enough land or resources to let everyone eat organic free range meat, there are just too many of us! SO animal farming is a sad but necessary compromise that has just happened without any care of compassion toward the entire lives of the animals concerned. This situation is one that will not change until one of two things happen. One is that we could easily eat meat in just half of our meals, thereby reducing the demand on animals by half! That would be an improvement, but not a real solution. The only REAL solution is for us to migrate to laboratory grown meat or meat alternatives. This solution is on the way, and i very much look forward to the day when anyone can chow down on a juicy bloody lab grown steak truly guilt free.

The dairy addiction

Dairy is a slightly different issue.. one based on addiction to powerful chemicals such as opiates that are contained in dairy products. As far as I’m concerned cheese and dairy is a drug, and most of the world is addicted to it. Its very obvious in our relationship to it, and how we crave cheese and devour it. Put cheese or butter on just about anything and most people are very satisfied and content. If you didn’t know, that is the simple truth about dairy and why people get so upset at the thought of not being able to have it. Once you give up dairy for long enough and then have a glass of milk, you suddenly notice how horrible is smells and tastes. Once you have gotten off the drug you can start to see it for what it is. When i eat dairy these days I do it with an awareness that Im doing it to feel good because im basically eating a concoction of drugs. That awareness is one that is good to have and can help us make more informed decisions about when and how often we eat it. NO matter what anyone says, I know dairy is not good for me and i can get more calcium in a bowl of hummus and tahini than i can from a glass of milk!

So, if you are a vegan hater then maybe i can inspire you to tone it down a bit. Like i say, why would you hate someone for doing what they can to protect other sentient beings.. even if it means challenging you on it. We are all free to make our own decisions and choices, and that should always be the case.. but we should always make those decisions from an informed place of truth! If you KNOW what is actually going on and you STILL decide to eat mass farmed shitty meat instead of free range then that is your own choice, but most vegan activists are here to at the very least make sure you know the facts.

SO, if you hate vegans and would be quite happy to see them used as animal feed then I would like to ask you this.. DO you buy free range eggs, or would you prefer to condemn a trillion chickens to a lifetime of torture so you can save $1? DO you buy the cheapest bacon you can get? When you buy meat do you even consider why some is so cheap? Well if you have never thought about this before I would like to invite you TODAY to at the very least reconsider! The next time you go shopping and grab that cheap meat, put it back and look for the good stuff instead. At least then you will have afforded the animal that died for you a dignified life.

The time for denial has passed! The meat industry is fucked up, and in the worst possible ways. People are eating horse meat not even knowing that it has been mixed into what they thought was beef. This is because there are too many of us eating meat! There is already not enough to go around, and unless SOMEONE does something about it, things are just going to get worse. If you eat meat with EVERY meal then why not try eating three meals a week without any meat. It's really not that hard! Meat does NOT taste that good folks! That is why we have to season it like mad and cover it in sauces and gravies to make it taste better. Vegetables and spices taste amazing when cooked properly, and if you take the time to find this out you will see! Please go and find a local vegetarian restaurant and find our for yourself!

Please stop the hate, and open your eyes to the truth. Animals are people too folks! ;-)

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I'm a weight loss coach and vegans are my toughest crowd. This has been true for the 8 years I've been doing this. My market is the morbidly obese and vegans are not to big of a piece of that for me, so I don't worry about them too much.

I run into "new" vegans, for the most part. These are usually obese people who decide they are going to change and therefore are going to "go vegan" to lose weight. After that they eat soy-laced "products" made to seem like meat in the grossest way possible.

Nothing I tell them about processed food and estrogen makes a bit if difference. Unless every once in a while I can get a reaction by mentioning man boobs to an obese going-vegan male.

Then these new people can't take it after a few weeks and go back to Dominos and McDonalds. I would prefer they gradually improve their diets and THEN go vegan if they want to from a place of better health.

I have also been attacked by vegans in a few weight loss forums over the years. They have come in packs to groups that are keto and paleo and start raving at us. Then the admins kick them out after they see what is happening.

I do not care what people eat as long as it is the least processed, organic, and "clean" food they can find. In my case, due to Rheumatoid arthritis, I rely on greens, organ meat, fish, and bone broth to stay as healthy and energized as I can. Vegans hate me for this so I avoid them as much as I can.

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Thanks for that report. I don't know where you are from but I remember similar discussions when I followed some vegans on Instagram for a while. This veganism thing is a huge gift for food industry but nobody cares.
What else can you expect from people who have grown accustomed to processed food for decades? :(

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I'm in Malaysia now, but most of my online connections are in the US. I think you are right about the food industry making bank. I see this with celiac people too. They find out that they need to avoid gluten. So what do they do? They start buying all kinds of expensive, chemical-laced "non-gluten" processed food!

And you tried to write a nice, level headed post...
but still, your writing makes me angry.

It is a slow attack on my very being.
Not because of any dietary concern for me,
but only because of your views on the modern meat industry and your (limited) view of life.

So, if you are attacked, isn't it normal to get angry?

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feel free to be angry..
its not an attack.. its an education! if you dont want to hear it.. well thats your own choice..
have you ever seen the conditions of mass farming .. you would probably shit yoursef!

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have you ever seen the conditions of mono-culture corporate farming .. you would probably shit yourself!

Education doesn't use blame or shame.

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not sure how i blamed or shamed you in this post? maybe you mean other people who have done so..

im also not sure how you can compare monoculture to animal torture? Plants are alive, but they do not suffer like animals do.. im sorry but i can not get my head around what animals are put through for their ENTIRE LIVES just to satisfy our tongues and save us a few dollars.. we can do a LOT better than this, and we will!

I totally agree - the meat industry is fucked up. But I see poorer people here ahead of me in the supermarket buying the cheapest, cheapest bacon or sausage they can to feed their families, and I don't think they're thinking of the environment, they are thinking of their next meal and how much their dollar is going to stretch. Until it's changed at a government level (factory farming and so on, allowing cage eggs to be sold at supermarkets - wtf) and at an education level (health, chemicals and so on) and a social level (the unequal distribution of wealth) and a spiritual level (where people understand it against a moral framework) I can't see a lot of change.

Saying that though, there are more vegetarians now in Australia than ever before, which is amazing. And we DO care, most of us, well, around these parts. It does seem to be human nature to satisfy their carnal desires, that's for sure. Those base instincts to eat DESPITE consequences.

I've never been a big milk/cheese eater - the taste and smell of milk sickens me. But damn, a good pizza every now and then - and I make a mean welsh rarebit... you know when you grate the cheese, add a bit of milk (vegan milk round here haha) and a bit of mustard and grill it - omg - drooling....However, the cheese I buy is local (less miles) and from an ethical company, so yay.

I love vegans for their passion and for what they do, it's just that their approach alienates people. Yet if no one is listening, what else are they meant to do?

Conscious, ethical choices are key - for everyone, meat eater or not. I have utopian dreams of each village/town/city sustaining itself with local food set ups - just like it used to be. We'd be so much more aware and reverent of all life, I think, because we'd be dependent on it in ways we aren't now, when we can buy stuff on a tray wrapped in plastic without any thought of where it comes from and the life that was put into it.

Oh, and meat packaging and industry - now there is a whole other post...

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yes it IS a fair point that most people are not able to afford top notch meat.. however i DO think its a matter of priorities, and a bit of awareness.. i think its mainly that people are not really aware of what it means to support this kind of thing that makes them buy the stuff.. if they REALLY knew the deal they might well manage to buy something else.. the problem is its all hidden from view and so people have no reason to really spend more when their hormone and chemical stuffed bacon looks just fine in its shiny plastic box. If we had a real education to show everyone what really happens then probably many would not buy the stuff.. a prime example is battery eggs which costs not much more then normal eggs, and yet people just keep grabbing them off the shelves.. im sure if you took someone to see a mass chicken farm and then a FDA approved true organic and real free range operation they would very quickly be grabbing the good ones!

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I absolutely agree 100 percent!!!!

Posted using Partiko Android

I see alot of hate towards Vegans online and when out and about, personally got nothing against veganism and its something ive tried to adopt in ways.

My only issue is there are a few that preach and push it to hard and i think thats where some of the hatred comes from. Like yourself i occasionally eat meat, only free range. With the rest of the time eating vegetarian.

I had a vegan burger this week in a restaurant as it sounded delicous and the other vegi choices were bland, as soon as the words vegan passed my lips the waitress attitude changed 😅 it was a odd experience.

Your right about diary its propably the biggest thing thats stopping me from becoming vegan, im addicted for sure...

Thanks for sharing

Posted using Partiko Android

Good post. Regardless of the modern mass farming industry, the core of the issue is about harming other animal beings with consciousness (same in kind/kin -- psychological/consciousness beings -- different in degree of psyche/consciousness that emerges from the biological organizational unit), taking their life, when they own themselves and their own right to freedom and life is not ours to take.

We have taken their freedom and their lives for so long simply because we've been in a lower consciousness survival-fear mindset. Now we don't have that excuse (and that's all it was). The excuse to survive doesn't dictate what is moral to do. We may do things to survive but it doesn't make them morally right. What we do doesn't make things right or moral, it's only a choice we engage in. Choice or survival doesn't dictate what is moral or right. What's moral and right should be what dictate our choices and actions.

We can evolve to be better beings. We can evolve consciousness to live as higher, realer and truer version of ourselves that live by higher consciousness principles of morality. The choice is ours.

Nobody hates vegans for being vegans; they hate vegans who act like evangelical Christians.
You get annoyed when someone intent on converting you to their particular branch of Christianity tells you that You Are Wrong, Theirs Is The Only Way, You're Immoral If You're Not Just Like Them. Does that inspire you to be like them, or does it make you roll your eyes? That's why.
Also, your conceit that anyone can be vegan is wrong. You do realize that health issues and food allergies exist, don't you? And that presumption is also what annoys people. NTM in America, it's literally a privilege to be able to afford to eat vegan. People working two jobs and making minimum wage don't have time or energy to be cooking from scratch, and convenient cheap food that they can afford and have time to cook is almost never vegan. It's the same reason why obesity is often associated with poverty in this country - fresh, healthy food is expensive and time consuming.
I was either a lacto-ovo vegetarian or a vegan for over a decade. I cannot be now because I have so many food allergies, I would literally die of malnutrition without animal products. It was not easy for me to make the switch, but I had to.
However, when I was vegan, absolutely no one gave me a hard time except for the ever-present questions about where I got protein, besides other vegans for not being "pure" enough when I was still lacto-ovo, even though at that point I was realizing that my diet wasn't sitting well with my body somehow.
I was repeatedly called "the cool vegetarian" for not being confrontational about it, or for not forcing my cats (who are obligate carnivores, making cats not eat meat IS animal cruelty) to be veg, either. I would bring vegan treats to potlucks and people could see that vegan food could be yummy, without a lecture about how evil they were.
Because of this, people told me they admired me for being vegan. Nobody grumbled. It's not the veganism, it's the attitude. The people doing that thing in the restaurant do not cause more vegans, they cause more people to never even consider being vegan.
The question is, which is more important to you: the cause or letting everyone know how moral and righteous you are? That's what people don't like - how many people that care about the latter over the former. They won't admit that they do, but their actions say otherwise.

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thanks for this comment
to be honest ive NEVER met or seen any of this vegan high moral stuff.. i gu3ess because i live in Indial.. this is all very new to me.. I can see how it must be very annoying.. although to be VERY honest i dont give a shit! This issue is too important so i understand why passionate people do it! Its time to cause INCONVENEINCE to people who dont know what is going on because it is intentionally hidden from them.. this shit cannot go on!~ it never used to be like this.. not this bad!~ the bigger the company the worse it gets!

im afraid i dont buy the 'aint got the time' story. that makes no sense to me.. there are TOO many dishes that take no time to make if you make the effort.. i live on tahini and salad some days.. i can make it in 15 minutes and then keep it in the fridge for the next day...

I totally understand SOME FEW people need to eat meat also.. that is a very small number of people though.. so not really a general issue.

also, SO many people can't even eat ONE meal without meat in it.. which in my mind is pretty crazy.. its all in the head! which is why i suggested people go try a good vegan restaurant and maybe be amazed!

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Not giving a shit means, less people will be vegans. It means that you think it's more important for vegans to lecture people than for people to maybe actually change their minds. That's my point. It does not convince anyone. You being in India where so many people are vegetarian or vegan is a different setting, so please don't presume to understand poverty in America because it's different here. Here, poor people are very different than poor people in India. Here, poor people eat ramen noodles (which aren't even vegetarian, let alone vegan), and salad and tahini is hella expensive. You could easily get 14 meals of ramen just for the price of one jar of tahini, not including the salad. But imagine my evangelical Christian example. When some right wing bigot tries to tell you you have to be just like them because they are the only moral people in the world and everyone else is an evil sinner and is all wrong and there are no excuses and everyone is going to hell - do you want to be like them? You don't. You think they are a jerk. They aren't convincing anyone to join their religion, they are turning people away from their religion. Meanwhile if they were just nice, then people might be interested. This is what vegans do when they say, "I don't care, you're a monster for eating animals, it's barbaric." They're placing more importance on judging people than actually getting them to maybe stop eating so many animals.
And you're presuming that allergies and limited diets are rare, but magical carnivore people aren't rare. I don't know anyone who eats meat at every meal. Maybe it's possible that those people exist, but they're way more rare than food allergies.
Vegans act like this, and yes, that includes your rant - and then imagine themselves as victimized when people take issue with their behavior, not their diet. If the judgement and condemnation would cease, nobody would give a poop and might be more amenable to veganism. Just like evangelical Christians. Nobody has a problem with nice Christians who don't run around telling everyone what sinners they are. But the ones who do, have a martyr complex that they are hated for loving Jesus. Nobody hates them for loving Jesus - they hate them condemning everyone who is not just like them.

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Well said, i hear u! Trucklifes comment below would be my response

Great answer @eco-alex to what is a very controversial question, but damn it, it is time for people to wake up to the reality of the world. To start Taking responsibility for their choices and actions, it really is disgusting how bad things have become and how much disregard people have for other animals. Being silent has never achieved anything xx

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Some chickens are lucky, luckily