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RE: Fuck Basic Income

in #dtube7 years ago

While I agree that we shouldn't be dependant on the system I wouldn't refuse to take what is available to me from them and put it towards my own support system and self sufficiency. We've paid enough to our governments to not feel guilty accepting some back when it's given. If, like you say, they put unreasonable provisos on it, then just be sure to be in a position where you can say 'no, I'll go without'. I see no reason to refuse money that will help get me to the position where I can say no to it if I need to though.

For example, we get family tax benefits. I don't claim them until the end of the year to make sure that I'm not reliant on them. When it comes we use it to invest in things that will save us in the long run. This year they turned the tables on us and cut the earning threshold for part of it meaning we only got half of what we used to get. This would have put a lot of families who get it throughout the year in debt to them. For us it was just disappointing.

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I understand the point you are making, and I'm sure many would agree with you, that if it is used for good then it will be okay. As @chieppa1 pointed out in his comment, it will end up driving up the prices of everything.

This image came to mind, thinking about if we 'use it for good'. Nothing good ever comes from granting more power to the so-called 'government'.

If they actually cared, they would lower prices, lower taxes, hell if they cared about folks' prosperity, they would start freeing up the Land, giving land away, so that we could live on it and provide for ourselves again, become truly self sufficient and community oriented again.

It seems to me that taking money from the government is hardly granting power, whereas paying into the government is and, of course, being dependant on them. Their preference is for you to be paying taxes and not claiming anything, which is why they don't exactly make it an easy process for you to claim anything back. My husband was recently made redundant along with 1000s of others and the 'financial advice' the government man gave them was on trying to make their redundancy last as long as possible so that they wouldn't have to claim jobseekers for as long as possible, even once they were eligible.

Some have suggested that enough money taken from the system could break the system. At the moment, the governments are cutting benefits in every way possible and going all out to claw in more money in taxes in every way possible, including trying to find any citizens overseas who they might be able to get more from. The US government has the UK banks sending out declarations to any of their own citizens overseas even. Having experienced how desperately they are upping the stakes to try and get more money coming in, I'm inclined to think that as the economy is collapsing and they are paying more out in benefits this government system could also be collapsing.

Of course I'm talking about the current system as it is in place now. However, as you were saying, basic income for all could very well be a government control dream. I believe there was already talk about chipping for the Medicare system, so I wouldn't put it past them to chip for a system like this. So I agree that we should never put ourselves in a situation where we come to rely on them. I'm under no illusions they care about anything other than themselves and their own comforts.

As I'm writing this I'm realising that many of us have the same goals, but we are all taking slightly different paths to them. I admire what you're doing, it's certainly not an easy path you've chosen and I expect you have and will make a lot of sacrifices. Many don't want to make sacrifices and I fear that they are the majority and will play directly into the government's hands.

Bullshit.

That's an argument as absurd as claiming A+B+C+D+E+1=5. You don't know what each variable is, especially not without actually looking into them.

You also may as well just say that we can't give the bottom 80% a raise, even though the top 20% has been getting a raise for decades, because if we did, all prices would go up.

When was the last time you told your employer to go ahead and skip giving you that raise, because you'd just end up spending it on the increased costs of goods and services anyways?

Competition still exists with UBI. In fact competition is enhanced with UBI. It would be pretty stupid to raise prices in a competitive environment, right? Would you raise your prices as a business owner, knowing full well that it would only make Amazon look even more attractive?

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