Proposal for a search system for tracking the flow of money out of steem via other cryptocurrencies to stop sock puppets funneling out money from self voting and circle jerks
I
was just discussing in #general at https://steemit.chat the issue of how to identify and stigmatise sock puppets in steem who use alt accounts to conceal their self-voting activity, or in the potential future scenario post-self-voting-ban, where this becomes the only avenue of exploitation.
It's fairly simple, it basically requires the analysis of the blockchains through which users can exchange out their Steem and SBD, for at least one level, perhaps even deeper, where it may funnel through two or more exchanges to other cryptos in order to become concealed.
Of course, users could use tumblers at this point, but again, I want to repeat that my approach to tackling this issue is not 'the whole solution' but rather a step by step escalation of raising the difficulty level of making these kinds of funds diversions, of earnings gained by the use of alts to sidestep a ban on direct self voting.
It's a pretty big project, but basically, until the diverted coins go out into the Fiat domain, where it is untraceable by simply analysing blockchain activity (and protected by banking system client confidentiality), it is possible that by finding corresponding amount of currency of very close to the same value, one can have some level of confidence that the transactions are linked.
Unlike in the situation where this exact strategy is being used by certain agencies in order to persecute dealers in contraband, regardless of the way you feel about it, by traffic analysis, uses the same principles. Timing correlations and quantitative correlations. This is how they attack the Tor network.
We can use the same thing, just as Steem flips the racket of exclusive right of money issuance used by central banks, to enable the raising of taxes, effectively, without overtly levying a tax (this is how the Steem distribution system achieves being able to pay for content without requiring users to sacrifice their funds to tips and payments, this is called "Inflation Tax" in Austrian Economics), to turn this around and indeed, potentially catch out not just abusers of the system, but even potentially catch us some secret agents out, blow their cover, and send them back to Washington to get Plastic Surgery and a new idenitity.
Mmmm would be awesome. The problem is also within certain family groups who exclusively vote for each other. I have introduced many family and friends to Steemit and I love supporting them, but also like to interact with the community. I suppose there is nothing much to do, but I am unfollowing quite a few.
Indeed, and your approach is precisely the way in which the community can express its response to this kind of short sighted self (as in concept of us vs them) voting, which it essentially is a degree of.
You really do have to prune your followers regularly, unless you are willing to just forego the use of the feed tab entirely.
I wish we could filter resteems =/
Yes, resteems should be used judiciously!
Forget sock-puppets and vote-trading (at least for now), that'll be very tough to stop.
Check out this garbage (apologies for the seeming self-promotion, feel free not to vote, but this issue is directly relevant and perhaps more serious than your original post):
https://steemit.com/curation/@lexiconical/exposing-advertiser-circle-jerks-in-trending-reward-pool-rape-and-bookingteam-com
(Comment upvoted minimum amount for top level visibility.)
Doubly self promoting, indeed. but I am going to read it regardless, because as an aspiring pillar of the community, I have to give due regard to well thought out responses to my proposals.
The term 'reward pool rape' is a bit inflammatory, but in principle this is exactly what I am campaigning to end, which is why I think beyond just a blockchain level ban on self voting.
For the record, that's one of the tags the community attached (rewardpoolrape) to this issue. I don't think it would have been my first choice. Actually, "abuse" was the first tag that came to mind, but it didn't seem to be used for this issue. I attached the tags I thought would get the most traction.
I tried to use the tone that seems to be resonating with the audience based on posts from witnesses like this:
https://steemit.com/circlejerk/@aggroed/autovorotic-asphyxiation-the-mega-circle-jerk-is-choking-out-itself-through-the-rewards-pool
Catering to your audience and such.
Indeed, and I even have very nearly used even more vicious adjectives like not just rape, but pedophilia, in on comment I made somewhere along the way, and licking balls and then eating...
I think it is not helpful to emphasize this way of condemning these things, but the point sticks, nevertheless, and conveys the sense of injustice that is going on. Thus I try to keep it clean, as much as I can.
I voted for @aggroed's witness after reading that post, as I basically agree with his analogy, 100%, and seeing it mentioned again, I realised I didn't also follow him :) Thanks.
One needs to know who one's allies are if one is to prevail, even if the Good is on your side.
You might want to check in on his newer post on the topic of flagging plagiarists where he seems to be taking a more diplomatic stance.
Self-voting doesn't really bother me, unless it's garbage/spam comments. But having the few spots on trending occupied for 24 hours by junk-mail will make anyone who opens this place and clicks trending think this is exactly the ponzi scheme they all (illogically) think it is at first.
I also think that #project-smackdown also demonstrates another use case for flags, in a more subtle, but emotionally potent pushback against complacence and decadence.
I am going to check this newer post out to see what you are talking about.
https://steemit.com/ethics/@aggroed/steemit-ethics-unintended-consequences-and-efforts-towards-deescalation
i followed you cause i see the problem is huge with wankers voting for there own content exclusively - i want to see self voting limited or banned too --we have to get the rewards shared around the creators of content
Having better systems for going after socks can be great but we should also consider the side effects and other things too that can be bad. The downvoting is an example of a problem. If you use Steemit like Facebook and upvote a great photo and people downvote it, then you lose your photo. That is very bad and that is censorship and Steemit has problems.
The photo is not lost, it still can be seen by its' link, and this is an interface thing not a blockchain thing.
What would the justification for someone(s) be to bury genuine original content if there was not some other reason to bury it - for example, maybe it is deemed offensive, or potentially even the evidence of a crime of those attempting to suppress it.
Remember, in such a scenario, there would perhaps also be other people who would take the opposite approach, and more likely a lot more voting weight behind it, pulling the content back out from the little red line.
It is good to be able to find the photo even if it is hidden.
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But why would I want my own post to be hidden on my own Facebook? Do we as a community all share the profiles and accounts and pages together like they say people all own land in communism countries?
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And anything can be offensive or a crime to somebody in the world and the block chain in global and different countries have different laws and different things offend each person and everybody all over the world and all of this becomes way toooooooooooooooooooooo subjective over objective.
In the end, nothing can be hidden on the Steem blockchain. The suppression of its appearance is the way that the community can punish offensive content, in the context of not being able to delete it.
But do you like that? Do you think this is a good idea?
Quite simply, the data is there to be used, and this is a positive use for it in policing malicious behaviour in a social network like Steem.
The authorities have no compunction about using the traces on the blockchain and internet server logs to prosecute witch-hunts like what led to Ross Ulbricht's imprisonment, even though the investigators are all also now in trouble for racketeering and scamming. According to proper court rules, their evidence is tainted and it is irrelevant whether it is true or not, it must be thrown out. The fact that it isn't is because this is a witch hunt.
Thus, if they are using this information to defend themselves, so should we. Just like Steem takes the expansion of money supply as a mechanism to fund the network's costs without adding the friction of transaction fees, the Central Banks use this to provide more money to favourable politicians to implement their promises, without them having to find more ways to tax people to fund it.
In Europe, when people post a video of what Muslims are doing, the police go to their house and take them to jail. Many people do not know what the Hell I am talking about. You will not read or hear about this from CNN or BBC or other liberal mainstream media. I am sad about what is happening in the world in many countries. Our information on Facebook is sold to governments and companies. The bad people in the world are always trying to hurt the good people by stealing information and everything and by using it all against the good people. But Steemit might be or might become like China in the censorship if they are not careful enough. Also, Europe is being censored too. Twitter and Facebook and YouTube is very censored. The left is a plaque that infiltrated into our brains through the education, the entertainment, through the doctors, and everything.
In fact, what would result out of the kind of action I am proposing, would be to strengthen the economic integrity of Steem, it would almost certainly raise the price through stopping the syphon of these malicious actors, and with more money available in total within the community, stronger defences can be built.
The more I work with Steem, the more I am becoming convinced that Radical Transparency is a crucial element of the emerging future society. By making the intelligence gathering a community effort, and placing all the data in publicly accessible, uncensorable repositories like the Steem Blockchain, the bad guys don't have the exclusive access to this data. This means good guys can use it to catch the bad guys, without anyone having to trust a bunch of scumbags who have over and over again proven they care nothing about the sanctity of life, peace and prosperity. People who market themselves as community servants when in fact they are robbing us all blind.
"In Europe, when people post a video of what Muslims are doing, the police go to their house and take them to jail."
Just wanted to chime in here that this was an excellent discussion thread. I, too, am very concerned about this sort of regressive censorship.
YT is better than FB, Twitter and Reddit, but Steemit is less censored than all of them.
I would like to know ho is doing this, so that I can not support them (even though my vote is only .02) It doesn't help for the long term health and growth to do this and I want this to be a successful platform that continues to thrive and grow for a long time! thanks for this post, following/upvoted!
So, I'm not sure how it all works with all the alt accounts voting on their own other accounts. I'm sure your idea could be a good one, but I don't know enough to understand it completely.
What I wonder though: Why is it even possible to upvote our own comments? You know, with our one account? It is helpful sometimes to get your comment more visibility, but so many people are constantly saying things like "I don't mind upvoting your own post, I do mind upvoting your own comments". Is there no suggestion to remove this option entirely? Simply stick to the "Upvote my own post" option when publishing, but besides that, just block upvoting for yourself. Is this even being discussed seriously by people who actually have a say in HF content?
This is one of the facets of #project-smackdown - as @timcliff has said, he tried to get something done about the minnows current constraints for voting, that there was a lot of resistance from Steemit, and other upper crust groups in the Steem community, to find a way to accelerate the process of discovering the right solution, and getting the mandate to have it applied.
I like your posts
I might turn that sock character into a digital drawing if that's OK?
it was near the top of the list of results on google image search for 'sock puppet'. I don't see any markers on it indicating no right to reuse, but I should double check.
It was not in fact marked free to reuse by google, so I changed it to one that is.
just upvoted and god damn did my voting power go up! You deserve it though ;-)
Ah ok I will check that out- thank u