Want to Put the Social Back Into the STEEM Social Media Platform?

in #community6 years ago

The Curation And Engagement Leagues

A few weeks ago, I posted about my first year anniversary as a member of the Curation and Engagement Leagues hosted by @abh12345. I talked about how the engagement league in particular was largely responsible for my still being around on STEEM. Part of that is due to the incentives (STEEM prizes), but more than that, it gave me a cold, hard look at not only what it took to be a top engager, but also what it took to actually start earning some decent rewards on my work.

In this post, I want to talk a little bit more about the engagement league, because I feel it's a worthy subject to bring up again. Also, something has happened personally which, whether it's noteworthy or not, I find to be kind of cool.


04082018_Top 25.png

To The Way Back Machine!

This first image is the Top 25 placers from the engagement league list which was tallied on April 7, 2018. You will note that yours truly appears at the top. That was the first time for me at No. 1, and I feel fortunate to report that it wasn't the last. I ended up No. 1 four weeks in a row, before being knocked off the top spot for two weeks, then took it again for the fifth and final time.

From that point on, which stretched from June through the second week of August, I had top five finishes each week, but for most of it, I declined rewards. I was spending all day, six days a week on STEEM, and I knew most everyone else wasn't, and didn't think it was fair that I keep on dominating due to what I felt was a time advantage.

However, then a certain member who's username starts with a "j", ends with an "n", and has "anto" in the middle came along, and except for a time or two when someone else put forth an amazing effort, or he took himself out of the running, he has been at the top of the list ever since. He's currently in another self-imposed hiatus.


04072019_Top 25.png

Fast forward to this past Sunday, April 7, when the latest list came out. You will note that once again, yours truly sits at the top—nearly a year to the day it happened previously. Aside from it being a small piece of trivia I can tell my grandkids when STEEM is a household name (along with the engagement league), I don't know that it means anything. You will be seeing another post, though, if I end up winning four straight—and losing the fifth.

Okay. On to the central message.

Not Enough Engagement On STEEM

Over the last few weeks and months, I've ran across many reoccurring themes, one being there's not a lot of engagement on STEEM. I even asked in a post why that was so, and was told that many times people don't comment because they don't feel they're a good writer, or because they can't think of anything to say. I always thought it was due to, again, not having time and wanting to maximize and prioritize what they did on STEEM.

Regardless, I bring this up, because you see what the top engagers are doing week in and week out to stay on the list. It requires at least a few hundred comments, if not over a thousand. However, more than that, it takes specific kinds of comments. When you look at the second list, you'll see a P for posts, followed by a C for total comments. The next three columns, PS (for people spoken to), CR, which deals with lower level replies, and CL, total number of characters written, make up the bulk of the work.

In other words, in order to make it to the top of the engagement list, you need to talk to a bunch of different people, have them reply back so you can also reply, and you need to say something while you're at it.

So, those who find themselves on this list aren't just talking amongst themselves. They need to find several dozens of others to engage with, too.

People Only Vote In Their Own Circles

If you keep going to the right, you will find columns that start with a V, and then UV. V is for the total vote count, while UV is essentially vote spread, or the total number of users upvoted. With most of the top 10 (in green), above 200 in UV, I'd say there's lots more people being voted for than just some voting circle. Folks here are constantly reaching out to new users, to not only comment on their posts, or reply to their comments, but to upvote them as well.

People Only Self-Upvote

Some people on STEEM definitely do. However, if you take a look at the engagement list, you will note that very few who make the Top 25 list have more than one self-upvote (and some of those were accidental, or because they were part of a curation trail that happened to upvote them that week). The vast majority have zero self-upvotes. That's because there are points taken off for self-upvoting on this list, and also, because many of us just don't want to self-upvote.

People Only Comment To Comment

Believe me, I've felt like I've fallen into this trap myself. Am I commenting to end up higher up in the leagues, or am I commenting because I feel like I have something to say that will add value to the post, and provide relevant commentary? I've struggled with it quite a bit. In fact, I've fallen off of the engagement league list more than once because of that and other reasons. It's hard to keep straight the motivation.

However, I've decided that if I have nothing to say, that I would only end up with something like, "Nice post. Keep up the good work. I really liked this," then I'm not going to leave a comment. There has to be something more to it for me than that. Which means, I could lose out on a lot of comments for the sake of commenting. So be it. I'm trying to add value, and I believe that the people on this list week in and week out are trying to do the same.

I Don't Have Time To Engage

Maybe you don't. Life outside of STEEM is, in many cases, a higher priority, especially when it comes to family and providing for their needs. You will notice that many of those who were in the Top 25 last year are not on the list now, and in some cases, it's because life pulled them away, or they had to curb their time on STEEM.

However, there are plenty who are also involved in other initiatives in some capacity, where they're running the show, or helping to judge the best posts, or any of a number of other things. They spend as much time on Discord as they do on chain. There are also many who find themselves splitting time between STEEM Monsters, Drugwars or some other game, and yet still muster enough to get on the list. Some, in fact, have started to limit their time with those games, not because of any lack of earnings or quarrels with the games, but because they truly miss the level of engagement they're used to having, and when they see where they've sunk to on the list, they want to improve.

So, What's Your Point?

It was sometime toward the end of February, beginning of March last year when I first was introduced to the leagues. I was already in a bad place, ready to quit, because I was getting much traction and I didn't see where this was going. The leagues sounded like a good idea, but I'd had been presented with plenty of those, plus my own, and nothing was panning out. No one was looking at my posts, no one was upvoting, and I felt like I was running as fast as I could.

Then, for some reason, I decided to give the leagues a try. I discovered immediately that I wasn't doing nearly as much as I thought I was doing. I found out that my lack of progress and success was less to do with everyone else, than it was to do with what I wasn't doing. My running was more like a brisk walk. My working my tail off was like binging on Netflix while munching on potato chips in my pajamas. And the problem is, from having ran a business before this, and knowing what it took to get that going, I should have known better.

But I didn't have anything to compare it to. Not until the leagues.

If You're Not A Part Of The Solution...

I'm not going to say there's not a lot of worthy initiatives, communities, councils or forums to be a part of. There's plenty. In fact, to be frank, we could probably do with some consolidation. Whatever. Where I'm going with is, if any of you out there feel like you're doing a lot to no avail, that you're putting your heart and soul into it and you're just being ignored, or that it's someone else's fault, I ask you, are you sure about that? Maybe it's true. But maybe I'm not the only one who was fooling myself.

Join The Leagues

There's one way to find out. You can see how you're doing relative to others. You don't have to be super competitive (in fact, in some ways, it's better that you're not), but it helps to have an open mind and a desire to improve. Head on over to last week's list by clicking on this link. There are no requirements to meet, other than wanting to see how you're doing. You can compete only against yourself if you like, improve incrementally, find ways to better organize your time on STEEM. It's certainly not at all about just incentives. That's a part of the overall benefit to be had as a member of the leagues.

All you have to do is politely ask @abh12345 to add you to the list. That's it. There's no fee, and it's a life membership unless you ask him to remove you.

Looking For A Worthwhile STEEM project?

For those with STEEM to burn who may be looking for some project to help sponsor, look no further. I offer you without hesitation or reservation the opportunity to check out and help support the Curation and Engagement Leagues. When it comes to supporting the original and ongoing intent of the STEEM social media platform—posting, commenting and curating—the leagues promote those activities effortlessly and to the tee. If you're looking for a way to overcome STEEM's so called societal ills, you guessed it, there's the leagues.

If you want to make the biggest impact you can, while fostering community, not just through one dApp or interest, but to all corners of the STEEM blockchain, help the leagues. While they are already in good standing, more incentives or larger prizes aren't going to hurt. If nothing else, it will attract more people to it and you will be a part of making something good better.

Images source—@abh12345 Curation and Engagement League posts.

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I am guilty of not engaging enough. I fall into the "not enough time" category, which I think of as partially legit and partially an excuse. I certainly could be squeezing in a few minutes here and there, and I think that is true for most of us. It just takes some motivation to use those couple of free minutes wisely.

I am blown away by the amount of weekly comments. Do people spend 8 hrs a day here? Or do they just read faster than I do, or skim posts, maybe just faster thinkers as far as what comment they leave? Lol. With the combo of my limited time and apparently sluggish browsing I am patting myself on the back for leaving 15 comments a day.

Hey, @ginnyannette.

I'm not sure how others do it. I know I spend quite a bit of time reading all of a post before deciding what I'm going to do with it, and there are times where the answer is nothing. So as far as engaging goes, I might like a post but have nothing to contribute. Happens more than I like to think about. :)

15 comments a day average gives you 105 comments. Depending on the other criteria being met, I think that's enough to get you on the list. :) This is just the Top 25. The list itself covers the Top 100 out of 500-ish members. I cropped it for space. The full list always appears on @abh12345's post each Sunday.

re: time

it's the biggest factor, and really, we can only do what we have time to do. I know there's plenty of people on this list who split their time doing many different things, but no matter how efficient you are, there's still going to be a set amount of time needed to it. And that's going to depend on who quick you think and type. :)

Really, this post was more to point out to folks who could do more, like me, but thought they were doing enough, that no, that's probably not the case. For those who are already pushing their limits, the intent was not to make anyone feel guilty. We can only do what we can do.

Regardless, I like seeing who's on the list and where, and obviously, where I place, too. The work necessary to get to the top most weeks is a lot, and the rewards, while very nice, aren't going to be the sole reason for doing it. Fortunately, I think there are more rewards to getting out there and engaging with others than just placing well in the leagues. I believe its helped my posts be noticed by a wider range of users, and I've met some really nice/good people, beyond where I would have naturally gravitated.

So, all kinds of free perks. :)

Talking is surprisingly addictive. I am not a social person, but I suppose it is human nature to get pleasure out of communicating. The more I do, the more I want to. Maybe if all the antisocial users such as myself pushed themselves to do 15 comments a day addiction would force us into more. That league could get really intense :)

I don’t know how some get so high with comments. LOL 😂
Time is a critical ingredient. I have the time but not the means , so it has to be a combination of things. But then again its not a competition to me.

Makes sense that it is a combination. Practice makes perfect I suppose, as far as speed of writing comments and finding the words. I imagine it is a great brain exercise to be reading, comprehending, and pushing out genuine words at a certain rate.

I take the approach that I am not in a competition.
I do have a lot of friends that I engage with and I have a good time doing so.

That certainly is the best way.

All your points are valid, I am sure. But, you forgot one thing - not all on here are @glenalbrethsen. :-)

I guess it all boils down to why people are here on Steemit, and how much effort they are willing to put into accomplishing what they had in mind.

There are people who post a question and get tens of dollars for it. Surely these people do not have engagement on their minds.

There are people who are shy and don't feel confident enough to engage.
Sometimes, people tried, but they don't get a response. These would put them off engaging.
Maybe there is lack of similar interest, or finding the right posts to engage.

But for people like me - and I am sure for a lot of others, it is due to weak Voting Powers. My Voting Power is usually between the 65% to 75% level. And that is after much restraint from over voting and commenting on posts. Under such circumstances, there is not much one can do.

So, we have to depend on people like you to keep the engagement going.

Congratulations on being top engager. I can imagine how much time and effort that cost you.

So as far as the upvoting goes, it is the lesser part of the engagement equation. The more important part is to be actively engaging with as large a pool of people as possible.

I guess the message I'm trying to convey here is this—for those who feel they're not getting any traction, it might not just be that everyone else is ignoring them or doing this or that. There might be a certain level of activity required to just get to a traction point, and the engagement league can help to see/obtain that.

The other thing is, people complain that people only engage/upvote their friends, and so on—well, not everyone just does that, and I believe the leagues are helping the members to break out of the tighter circles and go engage with others.

So, if there are people thinking that STEEM isn't all that social, and they want it to be, joining the leagues is a great way to help that happen, because that's pretty much what's trying to be achieved.

However, if there's different reasons for people to be here, then no, the engagement league isn't going to be for them.

There is definitely a time factor involved, too. You can only do so much. The point of the leagues, though, isn't so much to get to the top of the list (though that is a goal), it's to engage to whatever extent you can, while also helping to grow your own stake. And as I said in the post, there are plenty of people who have other things they're doing that end up on that list somewhere.

re: congratulations

Thank you. I spent about 5.5 days, basically—roughly 12-14 hour days. I don't keep track of the hours, I just know when I started in the morning and when I close up shop at night, but there's always going to be breaks in between, and some are longer than others.

Admittedly, though, I'm a slower typer, and I'm not the fastest of readers, and inevitably towards the end of the week I'm hunting around for posts more than anything. So, those who have a routine established and have faster eyes and fingers can do more in less time. :)

Glen, you knew what you have to do, how to do and you discipline yourself to accomplish it. Now, how many people on here can do that. Very few, I dare say. :-)

Yes, I do understand what you are saying about engagement. For me, I feel bad if I comment on a post, but do not upvote it. But my voting power is not enough even for me to reciprocate those who voted for me.

Take your comment here for example. Social etiquette would dictate that I upvote your comment too. But I am going to be very rude and not do that because I have to save on my VP, plus I know that my vote of 0.003 cents meant nothing to you. :-)

Anyway, all is good. I am not complaining. The rules of the game are clear and you play the game or you don't.

Vincent:

It's all good. And it's true. There is a game here being played, and there are rules of engagement, and we can choose to participate or not. I didn't think you were complaining, so no worries there. I didn't need to press it, either. I just thought I wasn't explaining myself, but I can see I wasn't quite getting the point you were making. And that's all on me, and I'm sorry I was pushing it. :)

re: social etiquette

No worries, there ever, as far as I'm concerned. So many people don't even give a second thought to commenting without upvoting, regardless if they could do it or not. I do it because I want to and because I can. After that, no expectations. Earlier when I couldn't, I didn't. End of story.

I think most people here want to have more fun than they want to worry about all the ways they can build stake or the time it will take to do so. If that's what they want, than that's what they should do. Some people don't have a whole lot of time. They do what they can.

Me, I'm probably on an ever shortening leash as to how long I can continue to put into this without cutting way back on my hours. If STEEM takes off, i might get a reprieve. Until then, I'm feeling an ever increasing urgency to do as much as I can, that I'm sure many do, and others do not. Even so, I'm human and I'm not nearly as disciplined as I really could be. I'd rather that, though, then burn out completely, a place I've been right at the edge more than once.

Hi Glen,
Yes, that's it. At the end of the day, everyone has their reasons for being on here. What they do, or didn't do, it is all up to them. Of course, it would be great if everyone is as hard-working and committed as you, but that is quite impossible. :-)
Have a great weekend. Cheers! :-)

For those of you that not only read the post but the replies also, I am in the top list from last year, not in the one from last Sunday, (top 25), but still on the list. I still look in and check each Sunday to gage how I am doing, not in the competition sort of meaning but in the personal meaning wise. I have been as high as third place and as low as 98, but have made it on the list every week for the past 63 weeks.

It is like as soon as you give your name over you want to try and improve, there are a lot of great coaches on "how to" do things on steemit and grow your account, many times post such as this one by Glen, and @abh12345's league post are only half the story, sometimes you need to read the comments and reply to get the full story.

Hey, @bashadow.

Well said. :)

There is plenty going on in the comments, in fact, there can be more going on down there than the post itself when it comes to value, and I think that's also a testament to the league's strength as far as building community goes.

You being on the list every week for 63 weeks and counting is awesome. I have no idea how many people can claim that, but I know I can't since i've not made the Top 100 at least two or three times.

There is something about having your name on that list that does act like a motivator regardless of how much time you have or what you're able to accomplish with it. It tends to be rejuvenating, making you want to do better for the next week.

Thank you Glen.

This is superbly written and a great advert for the Leagues. The simple fact that the content helped stop you from leaving the network is something I'm personally very proud of. My on-boarding efforts have been a bit poor so far, but at least I have one person on my list of stickies :)

Resteemed, of course :)

I figured I make another go at a post about the leagues, taking it from a different angle. If I can come up with another way to go about it, maybe I'll do this periodically. It's not like the post you make each week isn't reaching out to more than mine is, but maybe if there's reminders from more than one of us every so often, people will get a little more interested.

I personally think it should be one of the better funded projects/initiatives/communities on STEEM, and it's a flat out crying shame that it isn't—taking nothing away from the sponsors you've had before to now. So, can't promise anything, but I'm going to try to do more to help this along somehow.

I never found interest in it, for a couple of reasons. The first being, once i am out of the votes I can spare, I am done for the night. Occasionally I will still dip into the 70% range of voting power, but rarely now as i have disciplined myself. I also never leave dust votes. I rented delegation until I could solve that on my own. If I vote for someone words, I want it to benefit them, want to see them have the potential to grow. I say potential because many cash out constantly. I tend to vote less for those people over time though.

The second reason which is just as powerful as the first is

People Only Comment To Comment

I have had a few people from this contest (that rank high in it) do this to me a few times, and watched on others I follows posts. Nothing really to contribute other than "hi, I was here,bye." I hate that small talk with no energy in my physical world and do not have time for it here either. Time is precious and to spend time doing it day in day out makes me wonder if these people understand the precious commodity they are trading (their limited moments) all in a bid to rank in a contest or to get awarded .01-.03 Steem. Just doesn't make sense. Not sure why they don't focus on actually building something with the people they are interacting with, since they are passing by that way anyway. Maybe it means they don't rank high in the contest, but a few real connections are worth way more than hundreds of interactions where everyone parts still a ghost to one another.

We began interacting here before you joined this league, not long after I joined the site. I am happy that this league gave you a reason to stick around, and your presence in it helps to counteract the members who resemble what I outlined above.

Hey, @practicalthought.

Yeah. Obviously, things aren't perfect anywhere and the league is no exception. By and large, though, I think it's one of the more active communities that are least trying to do more, if not succeeding at it. The idea or concept is awesome, but the execution of it can always be better. I think people believe the number of comments has more to do with than it does, or they'd pay less attention to how many they can do and spend more time saying something.

I haven't been very thrilled with the character per comment count a lot of people do, but then, filling a comment with nonsense isn't the way to go either, so somewhere there needs to be that happy medium where enough is being said to be meaningful.

Either way, it's a large time investment and those who do that tend to fall off over time, so we'll see.

re: votes.

I pretty much keep my upvotes close to 85% for the most part. Sometimes lower since I don't STEEM on Sundays, so I'll extend it beyond that. It just means I'm spreading the upvote around a little more, and since a lot of it happens on comments, and above the dust threshold, my voting power an go pretty quickly.

Again, you can upvote just to upvote, a shotgun approach to curation, or you can be strategic, knowing you're never going to give out what you think a post really deserves, or you can just try to help as many people as you can. That seems to be the way most people do it. I only upvote what I think should be upvoted, and I do it with what I have available in mind, and what's already on the post. Some really don't need more, I think, and others could use more than I can give. It's what we all run up against.

Okay, the majority of us. :)

While they are already in good standing, more incentives or larger prizes are not going to hurt. If nothing else, it will attract more people to it and you will be a part of making something good.

Dear @glenalbrethen, it is a great opportunity that we present, provar costs nothing, we must try to see what happens.

Thanks for the info.
Pr EV

Hey, @fucho80.

You're certainly welcome. Does that mean you've asked to be a part of the engagement league?

Regardless, I hope to continue to make as many people aware about the leagues as possible, because I think they have a lot to offer, even for folks who are looking to enjoy themselves and be part of a community. And, if they want to get more out of it, they certainly can, with time and effort. :)

Does that mean you've asked to be part of the engagement league?

I'm not sure if I'm ready for this commitment now, but I'll try soon.

Oh, okay. Well, anytime your ready. It's not so much a commitment, really, but more of a way to see what you're doing compared to others. What you can do or can't do is really up to you and your circumstances. So, anyway, no pressure at all. Hopefully, it's more fun than anything else. :)

Hello @glenalbrethsen!

Maybe there are many like me (Venezuelan) who strives to improve the quality of the post to earn more, for the fact of having Steemit as a means of livelihood.

But it is frustrating, difficult, sometimes as you say, we feel embarrassed to post content, other times we leave the heart in some posts that usually receive only a few cents and you see others with a meme earns hundreds of dollars. That is disheartening.

As I once told a friend, I like comments and I love to answer them, but there was a time when I got a lot of comments and I thought it was because of the post and the main reason was because the post was voted by a curator who paid those who commented. I was saddened because I thought it had caught people's attention. But none of them commented on my other posts.

That's discouraging. But, as I mentioned at the beginning, we can't afford to give up. So what's left for us to do is move forward.

Maybe with practice and little courage we'll get a good spot on this network.

With the help of my dear friend @crypto.piotr, I am learning to engage with more people at Steemit and interact with others.

Thanks for sharing!

Hey, @jadams2k18.

It's not as easy to engage with people here as it probably should be. It does take a while, and quite a bit of work to find others who will actually comment back. I'm still doing it after fifteen months. I doesn't help that people come and go.

I think in some cases with those memes you speak of there's some bidbots involved, which means they're not actually making the amount that's shown there—they've already spent a lot of it so their post will get high enough to be seen. I suppose it can be discouraging, but it's also deceptive.

There are a couple of curator trails that hosts comment contests. I think they're good in that decent content gets some more comments and likes than it might otherwise. The downside is, that doesn't mean all of sudden you have a larger following. However, it's good to get recognized here and their, and maybe some relationships will spring out of them.

Thank you for clarifying that point about memes. I agree with you.

My working my tail off was like binging on Netflix while munching on potato chips in my pajamas. And the problem is, from having ran a business before this, and knowing what it took to get that going, I should have known better.

image.png

This. Exactly the same for me. I was sure I was doing all I could... Turns out, I totally wasn't. I think deep down inside I knew that...which was part of the battle.

Now, I do a lot. I help run @helpie (how I found your post, by the way), am one of the Lore Masters for Steem Monsters (along with my sweet hubs), I have a couple of discord/podcast shows, I'm a part of a few other communities I try to pop into and be helpful, I answer a lot of questions and generally try to bring the fun to the blockchain. 😍

Could I do more? OMG, yes. Every time I finish the day doing a little bit more I think of how much time I wasted (doing wonderful things like watching TV... seriously, it's how I turn off), and then think if I can just utilize an extra 10 minutes tomorrow... what could I accomplish?

Now, it's taken a LONG time to get to this understanding about me. But I'm glad I did, and now am seeing others seeing the same thing.

image.png

So, yes. Engagement is low. If yer bored come on over to the @helpie blog. I do a WACKY WEDNESDAY every week, just for fun and some prizes.

helpie token tiny.pngYou'll be receiving some HLPE tokens tomorrow (when I do the new post). Got questions about that? Just ask. I'll point ya in the right direction. 😍

Hey, @carrieallen.

This is all very cool, thank you. I'm glad you found something in the post to connect with, too. You never know what's going to resonate with people.

Thank you for the invitation, the tokens to come, the upvote and some more helpie cake. :)

Hello!

This post has been manually curated, resteemed
and gifted with some virtually delicious cake
from the @helpiecake curation team!

Much love to you from all of us at @helpie!
Keep up the great work!


Pastel-Layer-Cake-Slices-FTR.jpg

Manually curated by @carrieallen.

Very kind, @helpiecake. Very much appreciated again. i might have to cut down on the portions of cake, but I'll make sure to at least take a bite or two so I don't waste it all. :)

Dear @glenalbrethsen

I've heard few times about Engagement Leagues but I never really got familiar with this project and their goals. Thank you for pointing me in this direction.

It seem that you're "top dog" for most of the time. with the highest score? Congratz! :)

You've mentioned that you decided to take rewards from being part of this League. Could you please tell us more about this part? I believe many others would be interested as well.

Is there some rewarding system that would allow those who participate earning some extra STEEM?

ps. I hope you don't mind that I will share this post with few close friends, as I found it quite interesting and worth reading.

Have a great sunday,
Piotr

Hey, @crypto.piotr.

The Curation and Engagement Leagues are essentially a weekly contest with STEEM prizes given out for the top ten. After that, the next several placers may get 1 STEEM if they haven't self-upvoted in that week. In addition, there are specific spots that receive SBI. I think it's up to seven or so.

At any rate, to finish in the prize money, you need to score the most points as calculated by @abh12345.

However, the idea behind the engagement leagues is to engage, which in and of itself opens the doors for opportunity. In other words, the league provides incentives for members to do what they should be doing anyway, and do it a high level where it might actually produce some results.

And thanks for sharing the post. By all means. I'm hoping more will join. There's currently just under 750 people signed up.

Dear @glenalbrethsen

Thank you for that kind reply. I only had a chance to read it now. Appreciate.

Yours, Piotr

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