Chronicle Of The Foretold Steem Deaths

in #steem4 years ago (edited)

steem flagging wars3 charnel-house-269963_1280.jpg

Steem is a strange realm. It is difficult to enter (register). If you are in, you see a very different reality than promised (“we pay you for your content”). And if you look deep around, you see the population, the “Steemians” just want to kill each other with their weapons – the flags.

I think the worst danger on Steem pages is the risk of flag wars. Here you are my concerns.

  1. Voting power is power, voting power is wealth, voting power is money. That’s because man people are selling it. Much more than you think. Much more than use bidbots. A bidbot user can use the votes of hundreds of persons.
    The same can happen with flagging capacity, flagging power, flagging pool or how it will be called. People will want to use or sell their flagging power, also if it is not really necessary.
  2. People are selfish and egoist. Most of them will want to convert their “flagging power” to profit. They will sell their downvoting power as they do now with their upvoting power. Or, if they can’t sell it, they can make small favors to friends or community and help them in flagging wars.
  3. I suppose all people can flag and ruin others in the future, also if they don’t write anything. Without publishing anything. These flaggers can’t be flagged, because there are no posts. People without any talent or affliction to any science or arts, any work can enjoy their destructive instincts.
  4. You can make a new account, new identity relatively simple on Steem. (Sending Steem to some exchange and send it back to another account.) People can take anonymous vengeance for anything they take as an insult.
  5. By the developers the “downvote pool” will be “10-25% the size of the voting mana pool”. But knowing human attitudes I think many angry people, people seeking revenge or people who try to force to other behavior, to scare away the downvoters, will use also their upvote power (if possible) to downvote.
  6. Dead accounts, invisible posts, and comments will be much more frequent.
  7. A bunch of people will leave. Some may be leaving already.
  8. Maybe Steem price will fall lower. Or skip the next crypto bull market.

The developer @vandeberg has a different opinion, according to which the planned system:

does not give too many additional resources to users that will use/abuse all that we give them and frees up normal users that may not be downvoting to do so without financial penalty.

Economists thought earlier people were rational, they thought rationally. Later, as many theories failed, they invented new theories about behaviors with limited rationality:

Bounded rationality is the idea that rationality is limited when individuals make decisions: by the tractability of the decision problem, the cognitive limitations of the mind, and the time available to make the decision. Decision-makers, in this view, act as satisficers, seeking a satisfactory solution rather than an optimal one. (Wikipedia)

Are HF21-supporters too optimistic or am I too pessimistic (about flagging pool)? Time will tell. I’m afraid people are far from being perfect, they will act sometimes too selfish (selling downvotes) or too emotional (acting out of temper, anger). As far as I know, psychologists came to the conclusion that “Reward is better than punishment”. (Only one source of many.)

To say something positive: The 50/50 percent reward distribution seems to work better than the actual 75/25. It seems that Palnet and Steemleo are providing the proofs.

See my polls about flagging:

Do Flagging Bots Exist?
Would You Sell Your Downvote Power For Profit?

Other interesting reading about HF21:

Seven different ways how HF21 could backfire – @pibara

How The Ancient Vote Selling Worked



All good things come to an end. Zero hedge days it best with all things go to zero... Eventually

Posted using Partiko Android

Steemit platform is a small model of any state, this is my personal opinion. I have been on the platform for 10 months but have not understood how you can, using patience and diligence, become a successful user and start earning. A lot here I saw what I would not like to see in real life. Different people and these people have a different understanding of friendship and mutual revenue. Personally, I do not see anyone, that I did not become a WRITER OF THE YEAR, I am a self-critical person and I try to be honest about myself. This suggests that I was sometimes lazy to work well on the platform.
Your article is written in a truthful and human language, I really liked it. Thank you for a great post.

I think the system is too complicated for many people. So technically as socially.

They said the same thing about the internet. The technology will catch up .

Posted using Partiko iOS

Yes, but we need new, user-friendly developments. I'm using Bitcoin and altcoins but I'm always scared of the security problems. And the x shapes of Steem (STEEM, SBD, MVEST, STU, PAL, LEO, whatever) and the x passwords of the x accounts... :(

Thank you sir for answering my comment. Have a nice weekend

Right now it's probably impossible to become a successful user on Steem but this wasn't the case in 2016, or 2017. Changes happened to Steem which removed that. I started posting on Steem in 2016. In 2016 you could start with an account with almost no Steem and earn your way to whale status. Some posters actually did exactly that by posting.

Who can do that now? No one. It doesn't matter how good your content is or how you post, you'll never move up the ranks. And the current whales will not stop dumping the price.

Thank you, you are really right, I now have an idea about the Steemit platform of those years. Have a nice sunday.

3. I suppose all people can flag and ruin others in the future, also if they don’t write anything. Without publishing anything. These flaggers can’t be flagged, because there are no posts.

They, will point out that these accounts are only level 25 and can not hurt your reputation. That no matter how much Steem Vote Power they have your Reputation is safe.

I am not so sure that is going to be the case after HF21. I tried to get some one to answer that questions, but like many questions it went unanswered. They went on to talk about how lots of little down votes could actually remove financial reward,

They can have higher reputation if they blogged in the past. Reputation is not all - if they have Steem Power delegated they can make a lot of financial damage, I suppose.

The Death of STEEM could happen from any number of reasons. I don't think the downvote pool will be the cause of that. I don't think it will have a positive or negative impact really, at least not on the price. It will certainly make content value discovery confusing, but maybe that's a good thing. Right now the only content that gets valued, is the content that is bought and paid for with a voting service.

Point 8 has already happened.

Bitcoin, Litecoin, Ether all significantly increased in the last quarter. Steem stayed put and even fell last week.

Posted using Partiko Android

Markets are pricing in the future... But which one? There are also good news like the success of some Steem Engine tokens, I suppose.

Time to place bets on how low HF21 is going to pull the price of STEEM?

My bet would be the micro version of
@nathanmars his 777 vision: $0.0777

All-time low, wasn't by 0.072? Maybe intraday... I'm contrarian and I think markets are pricing in the future, so... the contrary can happen of that what all are awaiting.

I bet on a slight price surge, the cessation of uncertainty is always good for markets. Steem 0.4 USD, in some days after HF21.

Good guess. have a


Posted using Partiko Android

You need to own more BEER (6 BEER allows you to send 1 BEER per day)

I am with you 100% . Downvoting will be the death of steem. I don't mind the fork but the downvoting pool should be left out. I've never downvoted anyone and I never will. The flag wars among whales will die out over time but creating an incentive to downvote is a disaster. I love steem but am not sure it will survive the downvote. People can basically rob any steem staker on a whim.

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Punishment cannot be replaced by reward. Dafaq kind of nonsense.

Reward cannot be replaced by Punishment. Dafaq kind of nonsense.

Yes, why don't we just reward negative behaviors, makes perfect sense.

Yes, why don't we just punish positive behaviors, makes perfect sense.

The hypocrisy is hilarious,

And if you look deep around, you see the population, the “Steemians” just want to kill each other with their weapons – the flags.


We aren't talking about punishing positive behaviors you idiot. You are so stupid you literally bit the hook not once but twice. Why do you think punishment exists? Simply because people like to punish? You think it has no value at modifying behavior? You idiot

You cannot effectuate negative behavior by rewarding it, the only way to do so is by punishment. You steal, you cheat, you lie and you think that rewarding that will do anything but reinforce the negative behaviors, you whack ass imbecile?

This is exactly why I can't wait for the free downvotes to roll in, no more cheating assholes like yourself without any common sense to profit by buying rewards that are meant to be earned, you fucking cheater.

Robot? Or not robot? That is the question.

Come on bro, I thought that a picture is worth a thousand words.

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