The community shutout?

in #steemit7 years ago

There seems to be two sorts of big earner´s at Steemit, the ones that wait to self-vote and the ones who vote immediately (or close to) after posting. I understand that the popular posters get a lot of frontrunners trying to capitalise on the expected large votes to come but is this such a bad thing?

Closing them out also closes out all of the minnows from getting decent curation returns also. If you have a 50 dollar vote but get 200 on a post, is the difference in curation rewards for you that significant? Would it be better to wait a little and reward some of the smaller accounts so they have more incentive to curate?

My vote (with paid delegation) is worth about 8 dollars most of the time (as it is generally around 80% power) and even I wait to vote on the accounts of friends and family. This costs them as less goes to the author but, it gives a chance for their generally smaller audience to benefit a little more. It isn't much, but it is something. On my own posts, it is generally around the 30 minute mark. Unless in a rush, this is what I do.

So, for the accounts who are often getting 100+ dollars a post, would it be more beneficial if they let the smaller accounts frontrun their own vote at least. I understand that sometimes there are big voters who vote early too but often, these are friends and family also. Should the big voters wait so the small can gain?

I am not a great curator, I do not know how it all works in detail but it seems to be somewhat greedy to shutout the smaller accounts by self-voting early. I can completely understand small accounts and low vote values voting early but for the larger, it seems mean-spirited of sorts to take every SP possible whilst getting hundreds of votes from tiny accounts and a few from mega whales.

The other thing I notice from many of the same accounts is that when I have a stickybeak, their voting power is often close to 100 percent which indicates that not only are they taking large rewards, they aren't sharing much out. Now, some every day or two wreck their voting power and wait for it to return but, I have noticed that some do not vote much at all. Perhaps it doesn't matter as the pool gets used anyway but perhaps they are the ones who could significantly increase the value of smaller, quality accounts.

I am interested in the behaviours of people in the real-world and this naturally extends into the Steem-world. One thing that will be very interesting in the time to come is getting the data on how people behave on the blockchain here.

For example, it would be very interesting to see how some of the largest earners and benefitters from the platform use what they earn (power up or transfer out) and spread their own wealth to others. Are the ones who earn a lot community builders themselves? Does their voting value go to the smaller accounts or only to other high-profile users? I don't have the technical capabilities to answer these types of questions so if anyone does, that would be great.

When HF20 comes and makes changes to further incentivise curation, it will be interesting to see how behaviours shift. Most likely, the ones who are the most invested will also be the ones who learn how it all works. Will they choose to community build as well as profit or will they look to maximise their own gain at any cost?

This is not a criticism of the early self-voters, just some questions for discussions. What I wonder is if this is supposed to be about community, if the largest earners aren't acting with a community spirit, why would the smallest?

What is your take on it and if you understand Hardfork 20, how do you think it may affect behaviours?

Taraz
[ a Steemit original ]

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@paulag does some excellent, in-depth analysis. Look her up if you haven't already. Fascinating what she finds.

I have read some and I have heard she takes requests but I haven't asked yet :) I would get annoying very fast :P

Well, I think Paula actually enjoys the challenge of extracting something specific from an ocean of data... unless she's supper busy. But she's definitely one of the finest data scrapers on Steemit.

A valid, important and valuable question: I have to admit, that I also self-vote, but in the same time I vote for others too. In the moment I do self votes because I wanna finance an education and I also wanna start a beneficial charity project. For this project, I need some equipment to start with. I hope to finance a good notebook for video editing and also want to buy a webhost.

In general I would say self-voting is ok and everyone has to decide for himself what he or she does. But in terms of dolphins, orcas and whales I would say, it would be better if the vote for new and newer members - so they get more motivated and stay on the platform. I think we all want that the platform grows and grows.

I mean most of the high and higher earners already have a lot of money or their personal uses... why not helping good projects to grow. Projects which give STEEMIT outside of the platform a better reputation and help the platform to grow?

I think members with a lot of SP can make a massive difference how STEEMIT is represented outside of Steemit and they can effect everything here in general.

My wish would be, that STEEMIT transport the message, that Blockchain offers more than just financial platforms or so.... that the blockchain movement has bigger visions in terms of independency, peace, global welfare and so on...

I really hope that more and more whales will see this an unite forces to make an impact in different ways.

I am optimistic on that.

Concerning minnows and self-votes... I never would judge anyone for it, because for some people in countries with low incomes and not so good circumstances this is a blessing. Of course there should be a balance between voting others and self-votes.

Self-voting is not the issue unless one spam posts and upvotes nonsense comments but it is when they vote I question. Some vote late which costs them Curation rewards but, adds curation award value to those before them which is great for the smaller accounts and has little impact on the big voters.

Yes, some of the largest accounts have income in the real world too but I know that some also have early everything they have in Steemit and trading as they have a long-term view of the platform. I have a long-term view and struggle now for potential gains later.

There is a lot of chance for this (and other platforms) to fundamentally shift the way currencies and incomes work going into the future. It is exciting to be a part of it.

Again, self-voting isn't the issue here, just the timing involved.

This whole ecosystem is amazing and complicated in so many ways. It's so hard to expect the very wealthy to actually do good, but it seems as if that's a lot more possible in the new world of blockchain tech, and particularly right here.

I am just trying to get up to speed in understanding even the basic complexities, and what's actually happening with steem/it. I'm amazed by the range of people and "wealth" here. But it does honestly seem like a decent number of users who are far from poor in crypto/steem, are pretty decent about handing out votes to those who seem much much less fortunate.

I haven't even begun to look into the hardforks yet, maybe tomorrow i'll get some time to research that. [i'm sure you know more than me so i probably won't update you lol]

ALX

There is definitely a lot of complexity here that is continually shifting but I think that is what makes it quite an exciting time for the space.

There is a lot of valuable accounts and they are growing with the recent low prices of Steem and the increase plus the good conversion rates for SBD to Steem. Some do better than others at building the community whilst some do much worse. Just like the real-world.

Thanks for the blog, I'm new here and every day learn something new.

The problem isn't only with the curation rewards.

On steemit, the reward potential is huge but as the time goes and the community grows(and if the curation mentality won't change), the vast majority will have near 0 as a reward for months/years. Unless they have a friend with big Steem Power/followerbase, invest a lot of $$$ or get lucky and go viral somehow. If they don't? Most of the times the only way to grow is basically "fishing" for upvotes(example: a random "great info, nice post, thanks" comment), self-upvotes, bot upvotes for months. Honestly, it's quite impossible to compete with $100+ self/friend upvotes and old accounts, so trending page is not really possible. And if the reward is low, most people will skip. I've seen accounts with lots and lots of long, detailed and new content with $1-$2 posts. If the reward pool is really high(or people know that the author can give high upvotes)? Then anything is perceived as a lot better post and further votes + comments follow.

I'm no pro blogger, I don't take this 100% seriously but among the not so serious posts, I try to give more than simply repeating something like "Steem is the future of blockchain and will go to the moon" without any explanation(or even less than that) for daily $200-500 or even $1k rewards. I don't know how is that useful to anyone or worth a monthly salary.

People love contests and free SBDs and tv series too, I tried one with a 100% SBD reward prize. Paid some SBD to bots to have some exposure, nothing. Not a single submission or feedback, almost 0 views. That gives a glimpse how differently people perceive high(and how visible) vs low reward pool posts.

It take a lot of consistency and various approaches from many different angles. Unfortuntately, it is currently not possible to only focus on the blog part if one isn't interested in the community engagement part. I don't see that ending anytime soon.

The other thing many people struggling don't realise is that there is more to the platform than what is on the platform. there are lots of projects and a lot of relationship building that goes on in steemit.chat or discord channels. It is difficult to get the head around all the possibilities so many do not bother.

Many of the trending authors (I won't say all) have been here building the community in various ways for the last year and a half or so but, most of that is done behind the scenes.

It is possible for new authors to get decent returns but, it does take a hell of a lot of work unless luck steps in.

True, it's months of work for sure. Also what could work for new users is bringing followers from other platforms. For example, if someone has subscribers on youtube or facebook, that could give a kickstart here for sure.

Hmm, the steemit.chat/discord idea is good. That could help starting any new contest.

I havent a clue what all this means.

If i like something i upvote it.

Maybe im not doing this thing right. :●S

-'would it be more beneficial if they let the smaller accounts frontrun their own vote at least'-
I absolutely agree with you , be fair !

I'm still new on this and have yet blogged anything, so your articles are quite inspiring in the sense that it makes me understand better the community. Where can i find more information about hardfork 20 and what is about?

Oh, ok, the green ones are links...learned something more. Thank you @tarazkp :)

I'm a new comer and confused about votes of efficient accounts. Your post is an awesome post that includes what am i wanted to ask to the community. I hope someone can answer these questions.

Which questions? The ones in the post? me too :)

Yes, the questions in your post such as "Are the ones who earn a lot community builders themselves? Does their voting value go to the smaller accounts or only to other high-profile users?"

Thanks alot for this post, am new here i started posting 3days ago but am kind of confuse here , can you explain more about steemit pls or direct me to where can get more info.

There is a lot in the FAQ guide to get the basics and many links to other information to get in deeper.

https://steemit.com/faq.html

I still haven't actually taken the time to understand just how curation works. I just vote on posts as and when I find them. :)

It make sense very informative post....

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